What to do with fish while re-working the aquascape?

[kshrbkn]

My false julii corys have lost their barbels and show signs of skin damage after being in a tank with what I thought was smooth enough small gravel. They are now in a hospital tank with sand. (Other then the obvious trauma, they seem fine. Active, and eating when presented with wafers or zucchini)

I want to change my main tank aquascape to be sand on one half of the tank, and the other half to remain gravel to give them a better substrate (once they show signs of healing which I understand can take a while)

29 gallon tank. Planted, but no CO2.

Other tankmates are 7 black skirt tetras, 8 leopard danios, one bn pleco, and two nerites.

My question is..  is it more stressful to net and move the tankmates to work on the tank, and then move then back?  Or is it more stressful to them to work on the tank with them in it?

I would think the work would take several hours.

Thanks in advance

 

 

 

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 10/20/2022 at 6:50 AM, kshrbkn said:

My false julii corys have lost their barbels and show signs of skin damage after being in a tank with what I thought was smooth enough small gravel. They are now in a hospital tank with sand. (Other then the obvious trauma, they seem fine. Active, and eating when presented with wafers or zucchini)

I want to change my main tank aquascape to be sand on one half of the tank, and the other half to remain gravel to give them a better substrate (once they show signs of healing which I understand can take a while)

29 gallon tank. Planted, but no CO2.

Other tankmates are 7 black skirt tetras, 8 leopard danios, one bn pleco, and two nerites.

My question is..  is it more stressful to net and move the tankmates to work on the tank, and then move then back?  Or is it more stressful to them to work on the tank with them in it?

I would think the work would take several hours.

Thanks in advance

 

 

Would you rather be in your house when the floor and plumbing  is being redone, or in an AirBnB?

[Odd Duck]

On 10/19/2022 at 11:50 PM, kshrbkn said:

My false julii corys have lost their barbels and show signs of skin damage after being in a tank with what I thought was smooth enough small gravel. They are now in a hospital tank with sand. (Other then the obvious trauma, they seem fine. Active, and eating when presented with wafers or zucchini)

I want to change my main tank aquascape to be sand on one half of the tank, and the other half to remain gravel to give them a better substrate (once they show signs of healing which I understand can take a while)

29 gallon tank. Planted, but no CO2.

Other tankmates are 7 black skirt tetras, 8 leopard danios, one bn pleco, and two nerites.

My question is..  is it more stressful to net and move the tankmates to work on the tank, and then move then back?  Or is it more stressful to them to work on the tank with them in it?

I would think the work would take several hours.

Thanks in advance

 

 

 

It’s not really likely to be the gravel.  It’s more likely to be an infectious bacterial issue than the gravel.  I’ve had cories on all sorts of substrates over the years and never had one with barbel or skin issues that I could attribute to the substrate.

To actually answer your question, though, I would move and treat the fish while doing a full on escape like this.

[kshrbkn]

So.. I've been trying to read all I can on this..  and have seen arguments between substrate and infection positions, with burger having great outcomes.  Not a sign of any other fish in the tank in distress.  I've had then for five months or so.. and they seen to be growing fine.  

 

What should I be treating with then?  Both them and the rest of the community tank?

On 10/19/2022 at 10:03 PM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Would you rather be in your house when the floor and plumbing  is being redone, or in an AirBnB?

This makes sense..  but I thought netting them twice in a day seemed super stressful on its own

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 10/20/2022 at 9:24 AM, kshrbkn said:

seemed super stressful on its own

Its less stressful than changing the substrate and rearranging the scape.

[Flumpweesel]

I changed my substrate with the fish in just always worked on one half at a time so I wasn't chasing them about.

This was move from big gravel to fine gravel so it didn't cloud the water like sand can. My corys where and are fine on both. But they can move the gravel more.

I don't believe it bothered them more than gravel vaccing does

[TheSwissAquarist]

 

On 10/20/2022 at 9:44 AM, Flumpweesel said:

I changed my substrate with the fish in just always worked on one half at a time so I wasn't chasing them about.

This was move from big gravel to fine gravel so it didn't cloud the water like sand can. My corys where and are fine on both. But they can move the gravel more.

I don't believe it bothered them more than gravel vaccing does

What kind of substrate are you adding, @kshrbkn?

[kshrbkn]

On 10/19/2022 at 10:03 PM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Would you rather be in your house when the floor and plumbing  is being reCarib Sea Super Natural Moonlight Sand done, or in an AirBnB

Purchased this..  Carib Sea Super Natural Moonlight Sand 

[TheSwissAquarist]

On 10/20/2022 at 2:00 PM, kshrbkn said:

Purchased this..  Carib Sea Super Natural Moonlight Sand 

Maybe just rinse it first to be safe.

What does the scape look like?

[JettsPapa]

On 10/20/2022 at 12:03 AM, TheSwissAquarist said:

Would you rather be in your house when the floor and plumbing  is being redone, or in an AirBnB?

If someone was going to forcefully remove me from my house with a net to put me in a strange AirBnB I'd probably rather stay in my house.

[anewbie]

On 10/20/2022 at 7:00 AM, kshrbkn said:

Purchased this..  Carib Sea Super Natural Moonlight Sand 

DO NOT PURCHASE THAT SUBSTRATE; every single time i have used it I get anaerobic pockets and have to remove it. It might work if you keep it around 1/2 inch deep but then you won't be able to put plants in the substrate. You could try crystal river or torpedo beach both are slightly larger grains with crystal river being between moonlight and torpedo beach. I've used both without issues.

Other than that one problem i love the substrate.

-

As to where you put the fishes - buy a 5 gallon pail from lowes, homedepot, target, ... your favorite store. Rinse it out thoroughly (do not use soap or similar and when picking out a pail try to take one from the middle of the stack it is more likely to be clean). Put aquarium water in the pail and a sponge filter (every aquarium should have a sponge filter) in there from your aquarium. Set a magazine or similar on top to keep the tetra from jumping out. 

-

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by anewbie

[nabokovfan87]

On 10/19/2022 at 9:50 PM, kshrbkn said:

My question is..  is it more stressful to net and move the tankmates to work on the tank, and then move then back?  Or is it more stressful to them to work on the tank with them in it?

It's DEFINITELY less stress to move them and avoid the chaos of removing all the gravel and hardscape.   When I have to do that I use a bucket, put in the sponge filter or an airstone and cover it into a quiet place for them away from any noise.  They get to relax. 

With what happened to their mouths.  I would suggest dosing salt and at least one dose of bacterial meds to help them recover.  Sometimes damage like that can linger and they take a long time to recover.  The salt will help perk them up and then having the meds in there might save you from having a lingering issue.

 

 

On 10/20/2022 at 10:16 AM, anewbie said:

DO NOT PURCHASE THAT SUBSTRATE; every single time i have used it I get anaerobic pockets and have to remove it. It might work if you keep it around 1/2 inch deep but then you won't be able to put plants in the substrate. You could try crystal river or torpedo beach both are slightly larger grains with crystal river being between moonlight and torpedo beach. I've used both without issues.

Other than that one problem i love the substrate.

You definitely need to care for sand.  I had that sand in a 75G for about 3-4 years and had no issues.  When you do your maintenance I recommend moving the substrate around with the back of  a net, a chop stick, or your hand.  Once the sand compacts you'll have less issues with air pockets and can proceed with just disturbing it when you siphon to remove them if they appear.

Of note also, that tank was fully planted and did well.  Currently using Crystal River and it's extremely nice stuff as well.

On 10/20/2022 at 7:04 AM, Pepere said:

Nothing says you have to net and move them back in the same day.

You can wait a day or two….

Agreed. Especially if the bucket has a sponge filter in it from the tank!  If you run a HoB or canister, just remove the media, put it into the bottom of the bucket (the ceramic media, not sponge) and then go ahead and run an airstone in the bucket.

On 10/20/2022 at 12:44 AM, Flumpweesel said:

I changed my substrate with the fish in just always worked on one half at a time so I wasn't chasing them about.

This was move from big gravel to fine gravel so it didn't cloud the water like sand can. My corys where and are fine on both. But they can move the gravel more.

I don't believe it bothered them more than gravel vaccing does

Agreed! totally can work leaving them in, especially in a bigger tank compared to a smaller one.

[anewbie]

On 10/20/2022 at 3:37 PM, nabokovfan87 said:

 

 

You definitely need to care for sand.  I had that sand in a 75G for about 3-4 years and had no issues.  When you do your maintenance I recommend moving the substrate around with the back of  a net, a chop stick, or your hand.  Once the sand compacts you'll have less issues with air pockets and can proceed with just disturbing it when you siphon to remove them if they appear.
 

We can debate this; air pockets a non issue but sulfur producing bacteria is a problem. I did find adding some current directly over the substrate helped a little - I asked a fellow who studied this sort of stuff (has a ph.d. in the subject matter) and he said it has to do with depth from surface and ability of water to move through the substrate and some other issues. The fact that i reproduce the issue in multiple aquarium is the red flag as each time it more or less killed the tank and i had to remove it. I'm a slow learner and after the third time gave up on the stuff. There are a lot of variables such as water conditions depth of substrate and so ph all play a role so to understand why it works for you and not myself would require more details.

[nabokovfan87]

On 10/20/2022 at 2:50 PM, anewbie said:

We can debate this; air pockets a non issue but sulfur producing bacteria is a problem. I did find adding some current directly over the substrate helped a little - I asked a fellow who studied this sort of stuff (has a ph.d. in the subject matter) and he said it has to do with depth from surface and ability of water to move through the substrate and some other issues. The fact that i reproduce the issue in multiple aquarium is the red flag as each time it more or less killed the tank and i had to remove it. I'm a slow learner and after the third time gave up on the stuff. There are a lot of variables such as water conditions depth of substrate and so ph all play a role so to understand why it works for you and not myself would require more details.

Agreeed.  Reproducing the issue is absolutely a concern. I have this week heard a story from someone who had one bubble pop up and hit a fish (I don't recall the substrate) and within a few seconds the fish had passed.  I wouldn't wish that on anything and I definitely respect the concern.  The tank I mentioned I had a 3-4" deep sand bed and I would move it every 1-2 weeks to do my best to remove anaerobic pockets.  There's a few methods that people give in terms of caring for the sand and it's something that comes up on most videos for sand substrate geared towards beginners and how to care for it.  It's absolutely one of the major cons in an evaluation of substrate choice.  I do think it can be managed.