Here we go again with columnaris

[Mahi27]

I'm about to dose the day 5 meds so I thought I'd take some pics. See the white blob on the side of the pseudomugil -- before, that was a red raised wound. He and one other pseudomugil also now have whitish splotches all over their bodies, see other pics -- I'm assuming this is what it looks like when the meds are fighting the virus. 

The redtail splitfin goodeid has just the start of a saddleback patch on his back...that too is whiter since I started medicating. 

Last fish pictured is a swordtail. Idk if anything is wrong with him but he has a weird white dot at the base of his tail, so I am medicating him too. 

Since the fish still have visible symptoms, I am going to do another 5 days. @Colu, any advice or recommendations very much welcome...

[nabokovfan87]

Hopefully you see some more improvement with the next round of treatments.  I get the feeling you're at about where I am with round whatever it was with worms (and this algae).  I know it's stressful and I am just really hoping you and all the fish are able to get through everything.  Stay positive, keep pushing, you'll get there 🙂 .

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

@Mahi27 poor fishies. I see some tail rot going on as well. In my experience columnaris starts off white and as it’s medicated it turns to a grayish patch. After treatment scars will remain for awhile and it may seem like the fish is still sick based on appearance (still looks patchy). The scars take time to heal. It’s obvious in mine when they’re healing because they have a solid black lateral line that was interrupted. If severe/no improvement I water change for a few days then do a second course. Otherwise I switch to salt only and monitor progress.

The swordtail in the last pic is pretty. I like how his sword has a black outline.

[Colu]

I would definitely do another course of kanaplex and Jungle fungus clear fizz tab's and add a small amount of aquarium salt 1 table for 5 gallons that will aid Gill function and add essential electrolytes to give your fish more energy to fight off the infection the lump on the side of your rainbow fish could be  a lipoma I would just monitor the one with the lump more closely from my experience two full courses of treatment with kanaplex and Jungle fungus is enough to deal with persistent columnaris @Mahi27

Edited October 28, 2022 by Colu

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

I either do four 25% water changes or two 50% water changes before next treatment @Mahi27  and I make sure they have 2 airstones going in the tank.  Also you can run some carbon between treatments to help remove the previous meds.

On 10/28/2022 at 12:25 AM, Mahi27 said:

before, that was a red raised wound

It’s great to see some healing

Edited October 28, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

As of yesterday's reading, ammonia has been eradicated with no water changes, so the bacteria has sprung back from the salt.  Our patient continues to improve and had a good breakfast this morning.

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Here’s the guy today. He enjoyed some brine shrimp. Still keeping him at level 2 salt. I’m not comfortable reducing salt yet due to his patches. You can see 2 saddlebacks in the last pic. Pic quality is not the greatest; sorry.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 29, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Colu]

On 10/29/2022 at 9:18 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Here’s the guy today. He enjoyed some brine shrimp. Still keeping him at level 2 salt. I’m not comfortable reducing salt yet due to his patches. You can see 2 saddlebacks in the last pic. Pic quality is not the greatest; sorry.

 

 

 

 

He's Still not a 100% hopefully you will start to see more of an improvement in the next couple of days 

[Mahi27]

Man, this columnaris stuff really does not give up easily, does it?

[Colu]

On 10/30/2022 at 12:05 AM, Mahi27 said:

Man, this columnaris stuff really does not give up easily, does it?

Its one of the more severe bacterial infection your likely to in counter that why you have use powerful medication like kanaplex and nitrofurazone based medication as soon as you see any symptoms 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Checked on the dude today. His patches got darker. Black-looking patches now? What’s that supposed to mean? @Colu

 

pardon the detritus. I did siphon that up after the photos.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Colu]

That usually caused by ammonia burn when you get These black patches @Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 11/1/2022 at 8:21 AM, Colu said:

That usually caused by ammonia burn when you get These black patches @Chick-In-Of-TheSea

Oh not good, I did have some ammonia, caused by the salt.  Bacteria and salt don't like each other.  Maybe I should go to a lower salt level after the next water change today.

[Colu]

On 11/1/2022 at 1:10 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Oh not good, I did have some ammonia, caused by the salt.  Bacteria and salt don't like each other.  Maybe I should go to a lower salt level after the next water change today.

If you reading any ammonia start doing daily water changes and add a double dose of prime till your benefial bacteria can catch up

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 11/1/2022 at 10:51 AM, Colu said:

If you reading any ammonia start doing daily water changes and add a double dose of prime till your benefial bacteria can catch up

Will do. Man, I feel so guilty.  It's crazy how fast the ammonia can creep up with salt/med use.  ☹️

[Colu]

On 11/1/2022 at 3:18 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Will do. Man, I feel so guilty.  It's crazy how fast the ammonia can creep up with salt/med use.  ☹️

With the use of powerful antibiotic medications it will always kill some of your benefial bacteria it's a fine balancing act between treating and keeping good water quality 

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

Water test yesterday was .25 ammonia.  Surprised that small reading burned him.  He got a 50% water change though, and this morning I read 0 ammonia. However, I still changed 25% water today, just as a precaution.

I didn't add any salt back.

How's it going for you @Mahi27?

[Mahi27]

On 11/2/2022 at 1:04 PM, Chick-In-Of-TheSea said:

Water test yesterday was .25 ammonia.  Surprised that small reading burned him.  He got a 50% water change though, and this morning I read 0 ammonia. However, I still changed 25% water today, just as a precaution.

I didn't add any salt back.

How's it going for you @Mahi27?

Sounds like things are at least stabilizing for you. Happy to hear that. 

For me, there's progress too. In the 20gal acrylic, the open sore on the pseudomugil's side has reduced in circumference(?) but the center is still white and like, fuzzy? Looks like healing flesh to me, but I wouldn't call him out of the woods by any means yet. 

My male goodeids, in the same tank, with little saddleback patches are stable (no pun intended), not really worse or better visibly. Same with the glowlight danios in a separate 20 long. 

Of the 6 tanks I initially treated (about 180gal in total), I moved forward with a second full round of @Colu's regimen on just the two mentioned above. The others were largely asymptomatic and received one round of meds because visibly sick fish had been in there before but either died or were moved elsewhere. Since they looked good on Day 5, I threw in some salt and am continuing to monitor. They look fine for now.  

For the tanks receiving a second round, I alao added salt @ 5tbsp/gallon. That kinda nuked my swords, aponogeton, and vallisneria, but most crypts, stems, and mosses are fine. Amazingly, the inverts I haven't been able to get out of the medicated tanks are chillin. See pic below of a green babaulti shrimp doing shrimpy stuff in his 20gal. Oh, and one of my Amazon puffers in a totally different tank has a cloudy eye today, so...maybe I cross contaminated and need to dose that tank now too. Ugh. But also could be temperature, his tank is a little cold bc I can't afford a lid right now. 

So...where do things stand then? After I administer today's dose, which is the last one, I don't think the fish that still have wounds are going to magically look 100%. I guess I'll water change the meds out over the weekend and still run salt. Maybe I'll move the 3-5 fish who are visibly symptomatic into a qt tank by themselves for closer monitoring and then just run the main tanks with a little salt for a week or so. 

As always, input welcome. Pics attached, including kuhli loach tax. 

Edited November 3, 2022 by Mahi27

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 11/2/2022 at 9:15 PM, Mahi27 said:

Of the 6 tanks I initially treated (about 180gal in total), I moved forward with a second full round of @Colu's regimen on just the two mentioned above. The others were largely asymptomatic

That’s awesome!

On 11/2/2022 at 9:15 PM, Mahi27 said:

the open sore on the pseudomugil's side has reduced in circumference(?) but the center is still white and like, fuzzy? Looks like healing flesh to me, but I wouldn't call him out of the woods by any means yet

Yeah. I’m not sure what to make of it, but at least it got smaller. I’d stick with the salt and test for ammonia because salt tends to mess with beneficial bacteria, which is what is happening to me. 

On 11/2/2022 at 9:15 PM, Mahi27 said:

one of my Amazon puffers in a totally different tank has a cloudy eye today, so...maybe I cross contaminated

I’m not sure columnaris affects the eyes..(???)
 

On 11/2/2022 at 9:15 PM, Mahi27 said:

Maybe I'll move the 3-5 fish who are visibly symptomatic into a qt tank

I think this is a great idea. And your plants would agree. I’m actually surprised the moss doesn’t mind the salt.

[Colu]

It's more than likely an injury or temperature as you mentioned causing the cloudy eye in your puffer if you haven't had any ammonia or nitrite spikes if the white patches aren't getting any worse after the full course of treatment adding salt and monitor them very closely for the next two weeks if you notice the them start to get worse then I would follow up with another course of kanaplex and Jungle fungus clear fizz tab's @Mahi27

Edited November 3, 2022 by Colu

[Mahi27]

You guys are really helping me through something that's been so stressful and scary for me, I love my fish like my babies ❤️‍🩹❤️‍🩹❤️‍🩹❤️‍🩹❤️‍🩹 @Colu @Chick-In-Of-TheSea

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

On 11/2/2022 at 11:08 PM, Mahi27 said:

You guys are really helping me through something that's been so stressful and scary for me

I hate medicating fish, but we've got to sometimes. They're our pets. 🙂 

My guy has been doing well, eating well, very energetically.  Still has the black spots.  Ammonia went from yesterday's 0 to today's .25 ...annoying...

So he got another water change this morning w/ extra Prime.  Still no salt or anything added back.  The salt has all been water changed out now.

I'm letting him rest from meds now and enjoy the best quality water I can provide.  His energy is encouraging.

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

The guy in the recovery unit (snail tank/post-quarantine observation area) has looked perfect for at least a few weeks so he has returned to the display tank this evening. He instantly found his school and it was back to business as usual.

The guy in quarantine does not look any better. Nor any worse. He still has those black patches, gets a water change every day with prime, and today I’ve begun salt again at a level one. I guess we are in it for the long run. He enjoyed a few bloodworms this morning.

[Chick-In-Of-TheSea]

The guy has been flashing off the fake plants and the bare bottom of the quarantine tank.

[Colu]

Flashing can be caused by ammonia you could have had another spike I would test then do a water change if you have any ammonia @Chick-In-Of-TheSea

Edited November 16, 2022 by Colu