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Betta with bloating


Tam
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Hi all, this is my first post on this forum and I'm looking for help with my betta Lucien. I've had him for about a year now, in fact it'll be a year in about two weeks, and he's been having bloating/constipation for a couple of months now. The only way I'm able to keep him regularly having bowel movements is by feeding him daphnia, which he refuses to actually eat and I have to very carefully wrap them in his flakes every evening and hand feed him off of a toothpick because they're the only thing he'll eat. The thing is immediately after I feed him, which I'm doing just once a day now, he gets very bloated. It doesn't seem to matter how much or how little I feed him, his stomach just balloons up no matter what and won't go back down until he's eventually had a bowel movement. He's been a lot less active, he spends time resting on the floor of his aquarium or at the top of the waterline. I'm worried he may have some problems with his swim bladder, sometimes I think it looks like swimming is more difficult for him than it used to be, but I honestly can't tell anymore because I've overanalyzed him so much. It's not like he's completely inactive, he's just less so than he used to be. I told myself I'd make a forum post on Saturday so here I am but he's making me second guess myself a lot this evening because he's especially active right now, swimming all over his tank, but of course I haven't fed him yet so he's currently at his least bloated. I think he always looks at least a little bloated. I also cleaned his tank today and he's always more active after I've done that, checking everything over for changes. He's still very excited and eager to eat, though before I got him to regularly have bowel movements he did refuse to eat for a while. I'm really not sure what to do for him, I was wondering if maybe I should treat him with a broad spectrum antibiotic or anything like that. He's my first fish and I can't even fully express how much I adore him. I'm really afraid of messing up and making things worse. Advice is very much appreciated, I just want to do whatever will give Luci the best life. The photos I've attached are what he looks like right after eating, a top down view of him, and what he looks like resting at the top of the water. It's hard for me to get a better picture of him because the second he sees any kind of movement from me he gets excited and won't hold still.

For reference:

He's in a 10 gallon, heavily planted tank with two nerite snails. The PH has always been around 8-8.2 though I haven't checked in a while, nitrates 0 unless I dose with fertilizer, nitrites and ammonia are 0, not sure about hardness or KH, and the water temp is 78F.IMG_7140.jpeg.d67c45ef5788daef92189fb9f2e7febd.jpegIMG_7136.jpeg.2f245c355821c7623778c23bc85a08ce.jpegIMG_7150.jpeg.de1d204558bbd38285e022c3415587be.jpegIMG_7323.jpeg.ef2f60579eae2940dbb4da6745214a84.jpeg

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If you fish is suffering from constipation or has swim bladder issue what I would do is Epsom salt bath 1 table for 2 gallons for no more than 15 minutes for a couple of days as Epsom salt acts as a muscle relaxant to relieve pressure of the swim bladder and help with constipation

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I did try that at first only I had him in a smaller amount of the epsom salt and for longer, but I didn't notice it doing anything for him and found more success with the daphnia in getting him to have regular bowel movements. He is having a bowel movement every day and it's not stringy anymore/getting stuck on him, but it's not the nice dark color it should be. I'm wondering if there is something else that could be causing the bloating/constipation and if there's something I should be treating him for, like a bacterial infection.

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What I would suggest is feeding a combination of brine shrimp long side the daphna and two smaller feeding a day in stead of one he will be available to digest the smaller portions more easily leading to less bloating

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We found that the fluval bug bites the small ones work amazing to not bloat our betta and we used tannins in the water from almond leaf extract to act as a natural antiseptic 

hope your baby gets to feeling better

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@Chick-In-Of-TheSea Thanks! It's my first, I've had it for a year and I'm still constantly learning.

@Colu I did try giving him frozen mysis shrimp but he literally won't eat anything but his flakes, he won't eat the daphnia unless I hide them in the flakes which is not easy to do. I'll give it a try feeding him two small meals a day for a bit and see if it can help him.

@Betta I feed him the fluval bug bites flakes, he won't eat anything else, it's frustrating because I have one betta that I got in march who is like a trashcan and will eat literally anything, and then I have Lucien who is the pickiest fish you can imagine. I'll look into getting some almond leaves or extract... do you have a brand you can recommend, and does it color the water?

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yes it colors the water a little if you have a sponge filter it will stay in the water longer but it just barely adds color to my ten gallon but I have a hang on the backwhisper  filter but either way it’s not bad and will come out in your water changes I’ll show you a picture of my aquarium I just did a water change and put to teaspoons of that in there9E868ABB-9754-4529-921C-7B503F2146C9.jpeg.f977a4e37dfb430ca2c88920d0eb7564.jpeg
407525F3-61B3-4457-8B1E-5DD5BA00DE06.jpeg.8f12ed504983c6f13802d4b0acf26d30.jpeg

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on another note on the fritz almond leaf extract

To be honest with my whisper filter it just circulates it 

to really do a difference you would have to have a sponge filter or put him in another tank with this for an hr but I still dose mine no matter what it’s still circulating through the filter and water 

But when we did it for the treatment we just turned our filter off for a little bit and let him sit in it for a bit and then turned it back on

at this time it was just him and plants in there 

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No problem there since I use a sponge filter, but what about the sponge filter makes it more effective vs a HOB filter? Thanks for the info!

I don't know what's with that fish, if it's anything other than a flake he acts like it's not even food, unless it's a freeze dried blood worm, but I haven't given him any of those for a few months because I didn't want to worsen his bloating/constipation. 

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For bettas, they don’t like current. HOB needs to be modified for the betta so there is less flow.

I don’t think the sponge is better as far as performance. Both sponge and HOB build beneficial bacteria. However with smaller critters like snails & shrimp, they can’t get sucked into a sponge filter. Also sponge filters are quieter if you use with an air control valve or airstone, and they are more affordable.

Edited by Chick-In-Of-TheSea
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Sorry, what I mean is why is a sponge filter more effective vs a HOB when using the dark water almond extract? Also I was wondering if it's safe to use with snails, I don't want to add anything in that could hurt them.

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On 7/19/2022 at 8:18 PM, Tam said:

Sorry, what I mean is why is a sponge filter more effective vs a HOB when using the dark water almond extract? Also I was wondering if it's safe to use with snails, I don't want to add anything in that could hurt them.

Yes, the dark water/tannins from IAL are safe for snails. I currently have both my betta tanks so dark with IAL tea that you can hardly see anything and my snails are chugging along happily. Buy the Indian almond leaves on Amazon or in bulk, and put 1 or 2 big leaves in some hot water (I use the hot setting from my 5 gallon water cooler in a big glass and let it sit about 2 hours). It's way more efficient than using those Dark Water drops. You need a lot of it in there to make a difference. Dump the leaves that seeped in the tank as well. As far as a sponge vs HOB I have no idea honestly. I have 4 different filters in all of my tanks, and it seems to work in all of them the same 🤷‍♀️

As for the constipation, have you tried giving him peas? You have to take the skin off of it, but I have heard it's really good for bettas that have issues. The Garlic Guard helps my picky betta, you just add a few drops onto the food and mix it around. If you use a frozen pea, just drop it in a cup of water for about 5-10 seconds, take the skin off, cut it in half. You could try mashing it into a paste with the Garlic Guard and seeing if he will eat it. I'd also try feeding him directly into his mouth with a pipette if he hesitates. I have to feed my pick one like that and basically chase him down to eat lol. 

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On 7/19/2022 at 9:18 PM, Tam said:

Sorry, what I mean is why is a sponge filter more effective vs a HOB when using the dark water almond extract? Also I was wondering if it's safe to use with snails, I don't want to add anything in that could hurt them.

The sponge filter removes particles from the water, a HOB usually has charcoal filters, which will remove any medications etc. But you can remove the charcoal filter when treating. I prefer a sponge filter because it just does a better job for my betta tanks, the HOB was always collecting gunk and was a nightmare to clean. Plenty of Aquarium co-op info about filtration on the blog if you care to read up.

I'm currently having what looks like the same problem with my boy betta, hoping a 3-day fast will help, then will increase his brine shrimp feedings to 2x a week.

 

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On 7/20/2022 at 5:49 AM, JoCinWB said:

The sponge filter removes particles from the water, a HOB usually has charcoal filters, which will remove any medications etc. But you can remove the charcoal filter when treating. I prefer a sponge filter because it just does a better job for my betta tanks, the HOB was always collecting gunk and was a nightmare to clean. Plenty of Aquarium co-op info about filtration on the blog if you care to read up.

I'm currently having what looks like the same problem with my boy betta, hoping a 3-day fast will help, then will increase his brine shrimp feedings to 2x a week.

 

Right, I always forget about the charcoal aspect of filters, I've so far only used sponge filters but I do have a couple HOBs that I plan to use on future tanks but I don't intend to use cartridges and will do my own thing with them, so there wouldn't be any charcoal.

I hope fasting helps your betta, it hasn't helped mine unfortunately. I did a 3 day fast and at one point when all he would do was spit out his food he went a full week without eating. Bloating notwithstanding I'm glad he's at least eager to eat again, it's just he's only eager to eat flakes. His bloating problem seems to be more chronic which is why I was wondering if maybe there was something else going on causing the bloating. 

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On 7/20/2022 at 10:41 PM, Tam said:

Right, I always forget about the charcoal aspect of filters, I've so far only used sponge filters but I do have a couple HOBs that I plan to use on future tanks but I don't intend to use cartridges and will do my own thing with them, so there wouldn't be any charcoal.

I hope fasting helps your betta, it hasn't helped mine unfortunately. I did a 3 day fast and at one point when all he would do was spit out his food he went a full week without eating. Bloating notwithstanding I'm glad he's at least eager to eat again, it's just he's only eager to eat flakes. His bloating problem seems to be more chronic which is why I was wondering if maybe there was something else going on causing the bloating. 

It could be so many things. 

 

 

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