Issues with Salvinia Minima (maybe?)

[PaigeIs]

Water Parameters:

GH: 14 (250.6)  - tap water is higher

KH: 9 (161)

Nitrate: 40  (water change 30%, due on Wednesday)

Nitrite: 0

PH: 8

Temp:74

Fertilizer: Easy Green (2 pumps every other day) Seachem Potassium (2 ml 2x per week)

Light: Hygger LED  6 hrs per day 70% (also some ambient light)

Tank Size: 20H

 

 

I’ve struggled with floating plants.  After killing off both red root floater and hornwort, I decided to try salvinia minima. I also added a diverter to my filter output so the current runs under the surface.  The new floating plants have been in the tank for about three weeks.  It’s described as bright green and fast-growing.  Mine is a combination of green, red, and brown.    I can’t tell if the salvinia is OK or if it’s dying. If it is dying, what to do?

Edited May 31, 2022 by PaigeIs
typo

[Fish Folk]

I honestly do not have an answer, but I share your curiosity about this. Some stock S. minima photos have a few red leaves, but not as much as you are showing here. Can you tell if these are dying away yet?

You might try changing individual parameters and making observations. I wonder if the photo period is long enough? Or if the light is overly intense? Perhaps high nitrates contribute to reddish appearance?

[xXInkedPhoenixX]

I wonder if @Seattle_Aquarist knows!?

[nabokovfan87]

Such a unique plant! I am intrigued on this one.  Some green plants can get red under specific lighting conditions, but I don't know what exactly is causing this.  I was curious and so I looked up FishForThought's tank where he added some on the surface.



There is one ^^ slightly off color leaf, but I definitely don't see much. 

I see your light / settings above. I don't know if that is doing something to the plant.  I wouldn't think that light is too strong.

Edited May 31, 2022 by nabokovfan87

[Odd Duck]

I was NOT successful with S. minima and I think it was because I had too much surface circulation and too much condensation.  I have not tried it again since I “figured out” how to grow surface floaters(or maybe I just switched to more tolerant plants).  I see a fair amount of moisture on your leaves, and if I had to guess, I think that might cause problems.  I’m not certain that the reddish and brown discoloration is an issue, but I am pretty sure all the floating Salvinias dislike water on their surface.  Hopefully someone with actual success with this plant will speak up for you.

[PaigeIs]

On 5/31/2022 at 6:32 AM, Odd Duck said:

I was NOT successful with S. minima and I think it was because I had too much surface circulation and too much condensation.  I have not tried it again since I “figured out” how to grow surface floaters(or maybe I just switched to more tolerant plants).  I see a fair amount of moisture on your leaves, and if I had to guess, I think that might cause problems.  I’m not certain that the reddish and brown discoloration is an issue, but I am pretty sure all the floating Salvinias dislike water on their surface.  Hopefully someone with actual success with this plant will speak up for you.

@Odd Duck  I hadn't thought about condensation. The fish I have aren't jumpers .  I'll try taking the lid off and see if that makes a difference. Can't hurt, might help.   Thank you.

[Seattle_Aquarist]

On 5/30/2022 at 11:20 AM, PaigeIs said:

Water Parameters:

GH: 14 (250.6)  - tap water is higher

KH: 9 (161)

Nitrate: 40  (water change 30%, due on Wednesday)

Nitrite: 0

PH: 8

Temp:74

Fertilizer: Easy Green (2 pumps every other day) Seachem Potassium (2 ml 2x per week)

Light: Hygger LED  6 hrs per day 70% (also some ambient light)

Tank Size: 20H

I’ve struggled with floating plants.  After killing off both red root floater and hornwort, I decided to try salvinia minima. I also added a diverter to my filter output so the current runs under the surface.  The new floating plants have been in the tank for about three weeks.  It’s described as bright green and fast-growing.  Mine is a combination of green, red, and brown.    I can’t tell if the salvinia is OK or if it’s dying. If it is dying, what to do?

Hi @PaigeIs

Looking at the photo above I noticed something.


The leaf discoloration is almost in a straight band across the photo.  I'm guessing this is where the light fixture usually sits?  If so the likely cause is excessive light.  If it was a nutrient issue all the plants would be showing similar discoloration but for the most part that is not the case. 

Where is the reddish coloration coming from?  When plants are exposed to excessive light they produce excess Anthocyanins which are red pigments to reduced the amount of light those leaves can absorb.  Think of it as 'sunburn' for plant leaves.

Another reason I suspect excessive light is when I enlarged the picture is saw several small, red 'spots' which appear to be the very small flowers that S. minima produces.....this would also suggest higher light levels.  I grow S. minima in one of my tanks, basically to shade my Buce and Needle Leaf Java Fern and I do not have flowers produced but I tend to run lower light levels in that tank.  Hope this helps! -Roy

[PaigeIs]

On 5/31/2022 at 9:04 AM, Seattle_Aquarist said:

Hi @PaigeIs

Looking at the photo above I noticed something.


The leaf discoloration is almost in a straight band across the photo.  I'm guessing this is where the light fixture usually sits?  If so the likely cause is excessive light.  If it was a nutrient issue all the plants would be showing similar discoloration but for the most part that is not the case. 

Where is the reddish coloration coming from?  When plants are exposed to excessive light they produce excess Anthocyanins which are red pigments to reduced the amount of light those leaves can absorb.  Think of it as 'sunburn' for plant leaves.

Another reason I suspect excessive light is when I enlarged the picture is saw several small, red 'spots' which appear to be the very small flowers that S. minima produces.....this would also suggest higher light levels.  I grow S. minima in one of my tanks, basically to shade my Buce and Needle Leaf Java Fern and I do not have flowers produced but I tend to run lower light levels in that tank.  Hope this helps! -Roy

Thank you @Seattle_Aquarist! I got the floaters to shade anubias and buce, but I also need the light for the stem plants.  I am going to leave the lid off for a bit and relax.  I may be spending a bit too much time staring at the tank.  

Edited May 31, 2022 by PaigeIs

[nabokovfan87]

Anyone else feel like SA could be the bill nye of the ACO forums and just have plant lessons to teach us amazing things we don't know?

I always enjoy every breakdown provided. Nice!!!

[OnlyGenusCaps]

On 5/31/2022 at 11:04 AM, Seattle_Aquarist said:

red 'spots' which appear to be the very small flowers that S. minima produces.....this would also suggest higher light levels.

So, wile I concur with the high light assessment of the color of the fronds.  Strictly speaking, as a fern Salvinia doesn't produce flowers.  They produce sporangia that release spores.  This group produces two types, mega- and micro-, but I don't think of either as looking much like flowers.  I am curious, do you have a photo of the structures you are thinking of?  

[Seattle_Aquarist]

Hi @OnlyGenusCaps

I could be mistaken; this is what I saw when I blew up the photo. -Roy

[OnlyGenusCaps]

Thanks for the reply, @Seattle_Aquarist!  I looked back and realized I misread your earlier post, in that you said you don't have "flowers" on your Salvinia.  In that photo it just looks like glare from a magenta LED bulb in the fixture. 

If you are curious, here is a photo of Salvinia natans covered in sporangia.  They are pretty cool looking in my estimation! 

S. minima only rarely produces sporangia.  It's one of the species that is suspected of being of hybrid origin.  When they do produce them, the spores are non-viable so they are dependent on spreading via fragmentation.  Which they are quite good at. 

[PineSong]

On 6/2/2022 at 8:28 AM, OnlyGenusCaps said:

Thanks for the reply, @Seattle_Aquarist!  I looked back and realized I misread your earlier post, in that you said you don't have "flowers" on your Salvinia.  In that photo it just looks like glare from a magenta LED bulb in the fixture. 

If you are curious, here is a photo of Salvinia natans covered in sporangia.  They are pretty cool looking in my estimation! 

S. minima only rarely produces sporangia.  It's one of the species that is suspected of being of hybrid origin.  When they do produce them, the spores are non-viable so they are dependent on spreading via fragmentation.  Which they are quite good at. 

I love that folks here on the forum know this kind of info. I come here to learn and y'all are bringing it!