The Southern-fried side-by-side 55s [turned 75s] Project

[Jawjagrrl]

On 3/24/2022 at 11:12 AM, Patrick_G said:

I bet patient spouse could get a pretty smooth cut with the chainsaw, it could be cleaned up with a power planer is necessary. 

Well..... I'm the steadier hand with power hand tools, but maybe. By going to a 75, we may be able to just do one cut and not two, effectively keeping half of the stump on each side and not just a quarter slice pressed against the side AND back, which helps a lot. 

I proposed the planer, but he was a bit concerned about foreign objects that could be buried in the wood. Nails, bits of barbed wire given where we live - even bullets and shot. My late MIL was quite the Annie Oakley and had a target shooting area here years ago. This tree wasn't too close to that space, but I don't want to risk a good piece of equipment if a little extra elbow grease can do the job.

[Widgets]

If there is a sawmill nearby, I would at least inquire about the cost for slicing it in two (or quarters). They have the right setup to secure the stump and take fairly clean slices. It may be cost prohibitive, but I see contacting them as a win/win situation. You either get it cut at a reasonable cost, or you know how much you saved by DIY (and can buy more aquarium goodies with the savings).

[Jawjagrrl]

On 3/24/2022 at 12:45 PM, Widgets said:

If there is a sawmill nearby, I would at least inquire about the cost for slicing it in two (or quarters). They have the right setup to secure the stump and take fairly clean slices. It may be cost prohibitive, but I see contacting them as a win/win situation. You either get it cut at a reasonable cost, or you know how much you saved by DIY (and can buy more aquarium goodies with the savings).

That's actually an amazingly good idea. We do have more than one local small mill that we were already planning to take some pine to for conversion to boards. The could likely secure it for a proper cut a lot more easily than I would - and a lot more harmony at home as PS and I often disagree on best strategies. Unsurprising for adult kids of gifted engineers known for their free-thinking spirit and unorthodox problem solving ability 😜

EDIT: I told PS that the forum wants him to have a 55 for "his" angels (which FWIW are all of them, not on my personal list at all). I then said, "what would you think of a bedroom 55 setup with "fun" angels?"

"I think the kitties would really enjoy it, don't you?" 

Oh boy. I should mention that PS is the big picture, optimistic, sure-we-can optimist type, while I am the OCD, get-all-the-details-right, here's-the-realistic-timetable type. So reeling him in may be part of the future challenges with this project! Maybe that's a good thing, makes me more likely to keep impulse in check (green neons aside).

Edited March 24, 2022 by Jawjagrrl

[OnlyGenusCaps]

On 3/24/2022 at 9:11 AM, Jawjagrrl said:

The big kudzu vines are quite interesting (potentially), but not sure how well they would hold up, which is my understanding as to why grapevine isn't a good choice.

Fair point.  I have no idea about the rot resistance.

On 3/24/2022 at 9:11 AM, Jawjagrrl said:

A bit of a spoiler, but I have been working with it both submerged and as a hydroponic... and it's far happier fully aquatic!

That is dramatically unexpected!!!  I would have banked on it rotting out in either condition.  Those things don't normally even like to be transplanted.  You must have quite the green thumb!

On 3/24/2022 at 9:11 AM, Jawjagrrl said:

I'm actually a bit nervous about these big tanks now - feels like the stakes are higher and I've gone pretty public with it.

I wouldn't worry ab out it.  First - see my previous comment above.  Secondly, this place is nothing if not supportive of folks taking big risks whether they succeed or fail.  It foster exploration that way.  Part of why I am here.  🤓

[ChemBob]

If I had the sieve for 75s when I got my 40s, I'd have been all over it. I wouldn't be sordid any the size. If anything, it should stabilize the water conditions as you build out. 

[Jawjagrrl]

For all you MTS enablers following this thread..

Since I already had everything I needed to set up one of the 55s except a stand, I thought it might make sense to get one of them up and running first, taking some pressure off PS on his stand work for the main tanks. I can move QT cleared fish and plants into it - most fish will have to be mail order and I'd like to get as much of them in hand before it starts getting truly hot down here. So we did a breakfast out, then headed to the thrift store for an actual piece of furniture- typical stand designs don't really work in our old farmhouse. 

No luck, but we did find this for our farm frenchie that loves toddler shirts (PS is a Stones fan).

So then it was off to the antique mall, where we found this for about 1/3 of what most of the new tank stands cost. Solid pine, 50" long. Never noticed how much furniture is just under 48", but considering that is a common dimension for building materials, it makes sense.

How did I use those savings, you ask? Finally took the plunge on a DIY CO2 generating system by fzone - anyone have experience with it? Nice little canister/regulator/solenoid that uses citric acid/sodium bicarb to generate CO2. Figured at a minimum it would help our plants get a jump start given I've now got 2 75s and a 55 to 'scape.

I'm planning on using MD Fish Tank's substrate method for the 75s - fluval stratum in mesh bags along the parts most likely to have rooted plants, capped with river sand.

The 55 though? I have my Dad's old gravel (yes from from early 60s) that was in one of the 55s, but it's white. Having a hard time finding inert dark(ish) substrate. Seems like everything is PH boosting, which at 300 hardness is not what I need. Has anyone worked with either Caribsea's blue ridge (claims inert) or Exotic Pebble's black bean pebbles? I've seen claims that the black bean is volcanic, which would be reactive, right (since the african rift lakes are very alkaline)? My college geology is failing me after so many years, and YT research is failing me atm since it seeks more people need a ph boost, not the reverse. I'd love to find a small version of the Exotic Pebbles "black gravel", but may use some of them as part of the overall scape. MD Fish tanks used exactly what I have in mind in one tank, but forget which and I don't think he knew what it was. Hit me up with any ideas, not much luck at the local hardware store.

[Widgets]

I have a mix that i believe is blue ridge and peace river. It is the only thing I have left from a tank I put together in the mid 80's. I posted some pictures here, but it is the only substrate I have in any of my tanks right now. I don't have any more, so the next time I suffer a relapse of MTS I will have to decide if I want to do something different. 

I do not recall having any pH issues, even when new.

 

[Jawjagrrl]

Things moving along slowly. Decided that since I could get one of the 55s set up pretty quickly, I'd do that so I'd at least have temp housing for any fish/plants we don't want to wait on since we'll probably be into summer before the 75s are ready for fish. 

So bedroom rearranged for the tank - got my aquasoil and gravel (needs to be rinsed), a background (which arrived on fabric, not plastic, so ruminating on how I am going to attach it), IDing plants from the nanos that might make the move there that might not work in the 75s, like the dwarf lotus (not SA), a corkscrew sword struggling in the QT tank, maybe some of the moneywort or whatever the free cuttings are that I got from a seller with the jungle val (ratty pink leaves are emergent or high light growth, the smaller more compact leaves grown in my tank). Light on the way, splurged for new tops since the old ones had split and really hazy. I picked up some plants for cheap on AB to throw in there while I more methodically decide what to get from the Coop for the 75s.

The filter is on-hand and an interesting story. When I was teaching design years ago, I ran an internship program in the form of a small studio within the university that operated pretty much like a "real" small agency. Think of it like a teaching hospital for design and advertising "residents". We had real clients, contracts, etc. One of them was a major name aquaria company that came to us to redesign an "all-in-one" product that they were trying out at the time (this was about 15 years ago). They knew some people didn't like HOBs and also a lot of mechanics inside their tank, and the idea of small canisters, etc., wasn't really a thing too much that I knew of then. 

My interns thought this was pretty weird, but they also knew I had the 55s on the side by side stand in my office running at that time with HOBs and UGFs that I didn't love. The client brought us working protoypes of two such systems that included an airstone, filter and heater hidden inside molded resin shapes to match common environments. We got the job when I started talking about the rock one for Mbuna and the tree design for SAs - these guys didn't expect an art director to know about any of that (a NERM lurks beneath). My team developed better painting schemes for the two systems based on researching what rift lake and amazon environments looked like. I did see the wood design in stores later on, not sure if they moved forward with the rock one or not. They let me keep the prototypes and they have been boxed up until now. 

It may not be in there forever, but I want to try and run it in the 55 and see how it goes. There is the standard fiber filter with carbon (that I'll remove) and nice coarse sponge (already in one of the nano tanks to seed), plenty of room for some biomedia. 50 watt heater may or may not be enough, but I have some 100s stored and can add one, but the house is warming up fast. I fished out my Dad's old air pump from the early 60s - still works! Too bad it won't be ready as a scapes from scraps entry.

I've also just been researching things like lighting, prepping oversize foraged wood and rock, and substrate (very frustrating). I want to go with a very coarse sand and not really liking anything I've found. gravel and small rock has been hard too - everything natural seems to be really rough and sharp, and the smooth options end up being dyed (!) and/or dipped in wax/silicone, etc to make it shiny. I really love some of the substrates MD fish tanks finds, like the coarse sand in his most recent angelfish setup. Another video he did (wish I could recall which one, may have been a fish room tour) showed this really awesome small dark rock/gravel that looked like dark grey river rock, but really small, like maybe 1/4". Can't find anything like it so far, went with the caribsea blue ridge for the 55 as my best bet. Anything natural seems to be geared more for people needing more Kh/Gh and I need neither.

For the 75s, I've got river sand here, but I don't think it's coarse enough. I'm going to go with the MD bag method and bag up aquasoil and cap with coarse sand, which should work for the stem plants and minimize the churning up of soil into the sand at the surface once I have cories and geos in the tank - bags on order.

Weather has been unseasonably cold, windy and rainy, but I did a little wood gathering this week, all very aged hardwood with some interesting shapes. Turning up large river stone in places around the farm where there was never water, so not sure why they were brought in, but should be nice for the 75s.

Our rock is largely quartz, granite, etc. with lots of mica in it, like this piece I may try in the 55. As you can see from the oxide staining, I'll never need to supplement iron. Rust staining in the house is my nemesis.

I am largely grateful for good well water that is neutral PH but with plenty of mineral content that makes a wide range of fish possible. I had really hard water where I used to live and getting the old mineral stains off old equipment is a beast of a task - it laughs at vinegar, so I'm headed outside with a razor blade scraper. PS needs a good view of "his angels". which, BTW, he now likes the same kind I do. 🙃 Maybe that means more geos in the 75 and the angels in the 55? 

Edited March 31, 2022 by Jawjagrrl
Added pics

[Jawjagrrl]

Nothing to show today, but I did join the channel (finally) and placed a BIG order from the COOP this morning. I saw in Cory's comments on shipping costs going up for oversize packages on this 800k livestream this week, so I jumped on all the hardware, meds, food sort of stuff before that takes effect this weekend. Got me a murphy sticker on the way! 😍

Meanwhile Patient Spouse™ and I have fallen for the same angels even as I do battle with a badly stained 55 that is to be in our bedroom. Elbow grease and vinegar hasn't touched it, hoping oxalic acid will do the trick. Looking forward to getting to that stage, realizing that I enjoy fish more than the scaping and definitely more than the setup process.

Moving my garden grow light I use for plant starts to the other 55 and will use it as a holding tank for plants as they come in. Coop was out of a lot of plants I was considering, so I'll be a bit more methodical in the plant plan in the meantime before making the plant order happen. Do I need to run a filter on it?

[Odd Duck]

It will be happier with a filter and why not run a sponge filter and get it all seasoned and ready while the plants are in holding?  Take lesson from my experience and weight the plants down so the leaves stay oriented correctly.  You’ll be glad you did, or as in my case, you might regret that you didn’t.

Everybody’s been out of lots of plants.  I’ve gotten email notices that a plant was back in stock, replied in minutes of it being sent, and have it be gone before I can go to the website and buy it.  It’s been that bad with all the shipping disruptions.

Your tank may just have a haze.  My rescued Jack tank had horrible hazing that could not be cleared/cleaned away, believe me, I tried.  But it may also not be very visible once filled.  🤷🏻‍♀️ Have you leak tested yet?  Seems like you mentioned you had.  Was the hazing visible during the leak test?

[Odd Duck]

The Jacks came in a 55 G that was much too small.  As soon as I could I upgraded them to the 75 G.

[Jawjagrrl]

On 4/1/2022 at 4:26 PM, Odd Duck said:

It will be happier with a filter and why not run a sponge filter and get it all seasoned and ready while the plants are in holding?  Take lesson from my experience and weight the plants down so the leaves stay oriented correctly.  You’ll be glad you did, or as in my case, you might regret that you didn’t.

Everybody’s been out of lots of plants.  I’ve gotten email notices that a plant was back in stock, replied in minutes of it being sent, and have it be gone before I can go to the website and buy it.  It’s been that bad with all the shipping disruptions.

Your tank may just have a haze.  My rescued Jack tank had horrible hazing that could not be cleared/cleaned away, believe me, I tried.  But it may also not be very visible once filled.  🤷🏻‍♀️ Have you leak tested yet?  Seems like you mentioned you had.  Was the hazing visible during the leak test?

4 large sponge filters have already shipped(!) from the Coop order I placed late this morning - they are amazing! Easy enough to add one to the other tank when it arrives. Plant weights are also part of that order, but glad you mentioned orientation, I wouldn't have thought about that and it makes complete sense.

I think the out of stock plants was a sign to not be impulsive and save the plants for another order. I don't want Patient Spouse™ to start feeling pressured on the stand cosmetics anyway. Will see what my grab bag plant assortment I got on AB looks like next week in the meantime.

Honestly I didn't pay that much attention to how clear the glass looked when I filled it for the water test. They have the deposits you get when the tank is no longer in use but still partially filled with water because life happens. I didn't attempt to scrape it for the test, just filled it up, so the water was cloudy from 20yo dried algae on the bottom, etc. I might try filling it up outside again and seeing how it looks tomorrow. Glad I didn't get a black background though - tons of scratches on the back glass from the Mbuna days that I'm sure would show up. 

Jacks look so amazing, but I was wisely advised to not try them in the 55 even in the 90s. So of course I put an oscar, a severum, a pleco and 3 silver dollars in there instead! Live and learn - but that tank actually was smooth sailing for several years, but I think I had the most chill oscar ever made.

Edited April 1, 2022 by Jawjagrrl

[Torrey]

On 4/1/2022 at 2:57 PM, Jawjagrrl said:

4 large sponge filters have already shipped(!) from the Coop order I placed late this morning - they are amazing! Easy enough to add one to the other tank when it arrives. Plant weights are also part of that order, but glad you mentioned orientation, I wouldn't have thought about that and it makes complete sense.

I think the out of stock plants was a sign to not be impulsive and save the plants for another order. I don't want Patient Spouse™ to start feeling pressured on the stand cosmetics anyway. Will see what my grab bag plant assortment I got on AB looks like next week in the meantime.

Honestly I didn't pay that much attention to how clear the glass looked when I filled it for the water test. They have the deposits you get when the tank is no longer in use but still partially filled with water because life happens. I didn't attempt to scrape it for the test, just filled it up, so the water was cloudy from 20yo dried algae on the bottom, etc. I might try filling it up outside again and seeing how it looks tomorrow. Glad I didn't get a black background though - tons of scratches on the back glass from the Mbuna days that I'm sure would show up. 

Jacks look so amazing, but I was wisely advised to not try them in the 55 even in the 90s. So of course I put an oscar, a severum, a pleco and 3 silver dollars in there instead! Live and learn - but that tank actually was smooth sailing for several years, but I think I had the most chill oscar ever made.

I suspect you will find that filled, the haze goes away. I learned flat matte paint is the way to make scratches disappear, even if they are on the inside. I *can* get a film to attach, and hide scratches. The trick is to add a drop of Dawn to the spray bottle, truly saturate the back of the aquarium, and use the squeegee from the center *out*

Check repeatedly from the front to ensure all bubbles are pushed out from between the film and the glass. It's best to only do a rough cut of the film, and then trim it afterward (wastes a little more, which is 100% offset by reducing the frustration value). I'm glad you put the TM on Patient Spouse ™, it's perfectly fitting!

My Patient Spouse™ has finally agreed to working toward a more balanced ecosystem: 

We will be adding some nano fish with larger mouths to try and balance out the exponential growth of the endlers. I'll be catching the males and females with the best genetics for more serious breeding in the 10 gallons, and we will be aiming for a full "cycle of life" with some macrobrachium (I'm thinking some of the Whiskered variety?) as both population control and food source.

When it is time for you to select plants, the ones that will look best in your aquarium wll be readily available. I discovered buying a wider variety than what I *thought* I wanted was the best approach, because these last 2 tanks, the plants doing the best were the ones I wasn't going to buy, because I don't normally have success with red plants, lol

Congratulations on all your hard work!

[Patrick_G]

What plants did you end up ordering? 

[Jawjagrrl]

A somewhat productive day on the future 75s and the almost 55.

Was ready to mix up some oxalic acid to work on the stained 55 and not feeling too excited about it on a cold blustery morning outside, then the YT algorithm sent me a King of DIY vid where he showed his method for the same issue... barkeeper's friend! Not the More product, but the powder I use all the time. Organic ingredients and... oxalic acid! Way easier, so I sprayed down the tank with vinegar and scrubbed on a good coating of the stuff. 

My impatience was rewarded by a delivery notice... the red root floaters had just arrived! Grabbed Patient Spouse™ and ran up to the mailbox. I've always heard they don't ship well but these were great! Two full sandwich size zip locks of them for not much $$... maybe 25 cents each.

So I grabbed my other all-in- one filter prototype and quickly set up a plant nursery tank with the other 55 in the basement, still full from the leak test. Tossed in the new plants and used my grow lights as a makeshift setup. I still had my old vinyl background, so I just slid next to the wall. Actually still looks halfway decent.

Floaters.... floating.

Meanwhile Patient Spouse™ was starting the rebuild on my old stand, which now needs to be 6.5" deeper to accommodate the 75s. Hated to see all the nice screw hole covers undone, but all in the name of progress, right?

Time to rinse off the paste on the tank. I was ready to fly to Canada to hug Joey... at first. It looked sparkling! But as it dried, I could see a lot of the stains were still there.

But... it looks pretty good wet, so I think it will be okay filled, which hopefully happens tomorrow. 

Meanwhile Patient Spouse™ got the stand apart. A little bittersweet because the friend that built it for me did a nice job. He was a big part of growing my love for the hobby - we worked in the same office and would often grab lunch and "just look" in the LFS. 

Patient Spouse™ asked me if I had misgivings about seeing it disassembled. But a bit of my old friend lives on in it - and my new NERM partner is bringing it to completion. ❤️

Next up: hopefully some water in a big tank!

Edited April 3, 2022 by Jawjagrrl

[Jawjagrrl]

On 4/1/2022 at 7:37 PM, Torrey said:

I *can* get a film to attach, and hide scratches. The trick is to add a drop of Dawn to the spray bottle, truly saturate the back of the aquarium, and use the squeegee from the center *out*

Check repeatedly from the front to ensure all bubbles are pushed out from between the film and the glass. It's best to only do a rough cut of the film, and then trim it afterward (wastes a little more, which is 100% offset by reducing the frustration value).

I'm glad you put the TM on Patient Spouse ™, it's perfectly fitting!

My Patient Spouse™ has finally agreed to working toward a more balanced ecosystem: 

We will be adding some nano fish with larger mouths to try and balance out the exponential growth of the endlers. 

I discovered buying a wider variety than what I *thought* I wanted was the best approach, because these last 2 tanks, the plants doing the best were the ones I wasn't going to buy,

When I set up my 90s tanks, the images were like contact paper, but I kept the backing on and used vaseline to adhere... worked like a charm! But what I got last week is actually printed on a thin fabric, not plastic. Thinking of using a solution of water with a bit of corn starch to adhere - old trick to dress up white walls in apartments without damaging the drywall using thin fabric. 

I wish I could take credit for the TM, but I wasn't the first in my journal to do so. But I love it, he can be PS for short.

@Patrick_G, I'm going to see what comes in my mystery plant box this week first - price was right and plenty of places in small tanks to see how they do. The seller also has hard water, so I suspect there may be some good options.

I'm still not 100% what the stem plant in my jar is, but it got it's first new pink leaf yesterday!

Edited April 3, 2022 by Jawjagrrl

[Jawjagrrl]

This update is a bit more about the rededicated 55 "fun angel" tank than the 75s as Patient Spouse™ is only free in the weekends to work on the stand. Which he did get the frame back together with the wider crosspieces for the 75, complete with all the same roundovers as the original.

We've discussed skinning it out between the horizontal frame elements as a simpler way of finishing with a painted finish and not stain. The "floor" will sit below the lower frame edge and sealed with silicone as a way to create a spill tray. Laminate/formica over whatever base material he chooses. I keep reminding him that it is just us getting this into the house once complete 😉

Meanwhile I was giving the 55 tank one last effort at removing the water marks without much success. Like much of my glassware from my old home, I think it has been permanently etched. Much less noticable with water in it, so moving on.

In my last update I mentioned the background I ordered arrived... on fabric! So I opted to try a method I knew from my days renting as an art student - cornstarch and water. I didn't have cornstarch on hand, but I did have arrowroot, so went with that. Mix with room temp water, then add more boiling water to make a milk-like "glue". I taped down the top edge and smoothed out (ironed) before applying the paste.

After application, everything smoothed out, all bubbles removed. Looks pretty tidy!

But there was a problem. I didn't "activate" the arrowroot sufficiently with the hot water, and it never made a good paste. So I had to reheat and try again. It came out a bit thick, but definitely stayed in solution this time. Harder to work with, but eventually got it smoothed out again. I trimmed the sides and applied Elmer's glue to seal the edges and prevent fraying. The top and bottom rails were carefully taped with clear tape. The tank is seen from the side when entering the room, so neat was important. Prior to the tape, the edges curled pretty stiffly, but a good sign that the material was stuck to the glass this time.

But there was another problem... haze. Looking back, I probably should have rinsed everything when I realized the solution wasn't activated sufficiently. I suspect the white haze is the undissolved arrowroot from my first effort. If I wet the material again, it would vanish only to return again when it got dry (right side in the second photo). Maybe it wouldn't mater with water added? Decided to sleep on it.

After some sleep and some real chores done, I decided I'd never enjoy the tank fully if I didn't redo it. This is across from the bed and the first/last view each day. At least the fluval light is awesome!

So I pulled everything off, did my best to minimize raveling. Rinsed all the arrowroot out of the fabric and cleaned up the glass. Plan B: an oil, similar to the vaseline I used decades before. I applied a light coat of mineral oil to the back, reapplied the fabric, trimming ALL edges flush to the edges of the glass, running a bead of glue to the top and sides. The bottom got extra oil pressed in but leaves room to remove and trapped air bubbles over time. But how did the front look?

Light glare makes it a bit hard to tell, but the image was fully saturated in color and tight to the glass. Success! But I was having second thoughts about my all-in-one filter/heater/airstone prototype tree. I could get it to look good in time with moss added, etc, but it uses a lot of real estate. Maybe just a sponge filter instead.

Finally coming together just a bit after numerous setbacks! My mesh bags arrived yesterday, so they got filled with aquasoil and layered along the bottom. Plant roots can grow through the mesh and the soil won't get mixed up with the gravel, especially when the tank is broken down/rescaped down the road.

Tried to get by with a single cleaned bag of gravel - caribsea's blue ridge. Not quite as dark as I wanted, but it is inert and full of interesting variety. I want to do a high back left corner and low front right. Perhaps even add a brown path to continue the one in the background print.

But.... more challenges. The replacement glass tops I ordered didn't fit this older all-glass tank and it took some digging to finally find some that were 22 15/16" long. The ones I got were 23.07"... and the space is 23 even. Ugh! The python doesn't fit any sink on this floor without some intervention of one or more faucets and an adapter to be named later, so it's the 5gal bucket for now 😞

But the plants should be here tomorrow, that should be fun right? Nope! The seller on aquabid was to ship beginning of this week but was "too busy" and is now mailing next Monday. Maybe getting things from the Coop, Amazon and Ebay have made me too impatient for something to take 2 weeks? It just sort of feels like the 55 is cursed. But as Patient Spouse™ pointed out, it's like a trial run for the 75s to work out all the kinks. My Coop order placed Friday morning was on my porch before lunch on Monday, cross country. Amazing! Heaters on order, so things are happening bit by bit. The stump keeps presenting itself daily as I do chores, and I eyeball it for the right place to cut every day - feels a bit like sculpting again. Hopefully more fun and less problem solving in the next update!

[Torrey]

On 4/6/2022 at 9:57 PM, Jawjagrrl said:

Maybe getting things from the Coop, Amazon and Ebay have made me too impatient for something to take 2 weeks? It just sort of feels like the 55 is cursed. But as Patient Spouse™ pointed out, it's like a trial run for the 75s to work out all the kinks. My Coop order placed Friday morning was on my porch before lunch on Monday, cross country. Amazing!

Your Patient Spouse™ and mine have very sage advice. They bought me a 4' tank to scape for the dining room *last year* for my birthday (2/1) and before I got it started, I had a stroke...

I still haven't finished it, and when I was editing video footage today they reminded me that if I had set it up last year, everything probably would have died between stroke... surgery... and getting covid (third bout/ first since vaccines) at my surgery and taking twice as long to heal because covid + surgery.

Maybe I'll get it done this month, lol!

Yours is looking great!!! If you ever do another fabric backing, it's worth sealing the fabric with a couple of coats of Clear Coat (from art school days, lol). If you saturate with the clear coat spray, scrape it smooth with a squeegee, double check no bubbles (I put tanks on saw horses to easily check other side), and then spray again after trimming edges, the fabric will survive pretty much anything on the back and shows beautifully once the tank is filled. I was breeding discus when I was at NCSA, and used many art tricks for my tanks to look good in addition to being breeding functional.

[Jawjagrrl]

On 4/7/2022 at 12:51 AM, Torrey said:

Your Patient Spouse™ and mine have very sage advice. They bought me a 4' tank to scape for the dining room *last year* for my birthday (2/1) and before I got it started, I had a stroke...

I still haven't finished it, and when I was editing video footage today they reminded me that if I had set it up last year, everything probably would have died between stroke... surgery... and getting covid (third bout/ first since vaccines) at my surgery and taking twice as long to heal because covid + surgery.

Maybe I'll get it done this month, lol!

Yours is looking great!!! If you ever do another fabric backing, it's worth sealing the fabric with a couple of coats of Clear Coat (from art school days, lol). If you saturate with the clear coat spray, scrape it smooth with a squeegee, double check no bubbles (I put tanks on saw horses to easily check other side), and then spray again after trimming edges, the fabric will survive pretty much anything on the back and shows beautifully once the tank is filled. I was breeding discus when I was at NCSA, and used many art tricks for my tanks to look good in addition to being breeding functional.

I'm so sorry to hear of all your challenges of the last year! I got the OG Rona and it was no picnic - barely kept PS out of the hospital with it. I hope the stroke has been a manageable recovery since. Seems like so many of us use this hobby for therapy of one sort or another, I know I am, which is probably why PS has earned his nickname. I hope to see that big tank eventually!

Should have known you were also coming from an arts background. My declaration of an art major (at a school known for ARCH and Engineering) was quite controversial at my house, but over the years my late father came to see that we were both problem solvers, just in different media. And I got lots of practical skills from it, like using spray mount correctly 🙂 Which I did consider using on this panel, but knowing two broken people were already going to have a hard time getting this up two flights of stairs from outside, opted for this route. The glued edges are doing a good job on the edges, but will keep the clearcoat in mind as well - I haven't decided yet how I am going to back the 75s. I had done the cornstarch before with success, nice and clear, but what I did seems to have worked well and the pictures don't do the color saturation justice. I'm starting to play with the idea of doing diorama with this now to an extent, like using different gravel to continue the path into the foreground, wood and moss to make the big tree appear to be growing into the tank, etc. My original intent was to set this up quickly as a repository for fish we order before the heat kicks in and stocking the 75s becomes too difficult. so I grapple now between a thoughtful execution now or later.

I did hear from the plant seller last night, sounds like we'll be good for midweek delivery next week, which is probably when the hoods will arrive. I've got a sponge seeding in another tank, an entire filter floss from another that will get squeezed out, and fish water from 4 nano tanks that will all get dumped into this tank next week - will be interesting to see how quickly a big tank cycles with that sort of boost (got some Fritz BB also). 

Time to rinse more gravel and clean some wood for this one - a nice spring day down here for it!

[Hobbit]

Ooo just checked out the most recent tank updates! I’m loving the background!

Since I’ve found two art students on this thread, I have a question: I tried putting construction paper on the bottom of one of my tanks since I heard that a dark bottom will hide mulm and such. But I just taped it in place, so of course it wasn’t flush with the glass and it was totally invisible. When filled with water, the bottom just reflects whatever’s above it.

If I used something to actually stick the paper on the bottom of the tank—something like mod podge—would I actually be able to see it? Or am I just asking for pain with that plan? I’m imagining bleeding+blotchy paper, air bubbles, and then more reflecting once it’s all said and done…

Also if one were to use paint, what type of paint sticks to glass? Any oil based paint? I have old cheap oil paints I bought to copy Bob Ross… 😄 Would those work?

[Jawjagrrl]

On 4/11/2022 at 1:14 PM, Hobbit said:

Ooo just checked out the most recent tank updates! I’m loving the background!

Since I’ve found two art students on this thread, I have a question: I tried putting construction paper on the bottom of one of my tanks since I heard that a dark bottom will hide mulm and such. But I just taped it in place, so of course it wasn’t flush with the glass and it was totally invisible. When filled with water, the bottom just reflects whatever’s above it.

If I used something to actually stick the paper on the bottom of the tank—something like mod podge—would I actually be able to see it? Or am I just asking for pain with that plan? I’m imagining bleeding+blotchy paper, air bubbles, and then more reflecting once it’s all said and done…

Also if one were to use paint, what type of paint sticks to glass? Any oil based paint? I have old cheap oil paints I bought to copy Bob Ross… 😄 Would those work?

I like it too - now I'm dealing with engagement anxiety - can I make the image in my head happen or not? Sounds like something an artist would say perhaps 🙂

My background is more on the commerical area, but I can be crafty when needed too. could try a test with some of your construction paper and various application methods, but if it has a lot of pigment the color will probably be uneven given the nature of the paper itself. since it's on the bottom and unlikely to get wet, you could always go with a colored posterboard. A higher grade of paper would probably retain a smoother look, but I'd lean towards a paint. Pretty much any paint will adhere to glass, so takes longer to dry, especially oils. Could be fun actually trying to paint a substrate and the challege of layering colors in reverse of what you would do with a paper.

For just a flat color, the plastidip paint would likely work well and is easily removed if you don't like the results.

Edited April 12, 2022 by Jawjagrrl

[Odd Duck]

I’ve got black window film adhered to the bottom of a tank I was using as a display while I was selling Jack Dempsey fry to encourage them to be darker and show better.  It still doesn’t look dark from the side, it just does a mirror effect.  But the fry can see it and darken.  I don’t know if paint would be different or not.

[Jawjagrrl]

CHAPTER 4: Between a Scape and a hard place (and the cursed 55)

My, but it does take time to put together a new tank. And in this case it's now THREE TANKS. But things are moving along on all of them. Lots of equipment is now on hand for the 75s - heaters, lights, sponge filters, powerheads, airstones, etc., much of it from the Coop. Also made a final decision on the substrate! Will use a base of bagged aquasoil (like the 55 in the previous post) capped with Caribsea Peace River, which fits my goal of something finer than gravel but coarser than typical sand. Got a small amount of the gemstone creek (slightly larger) and have a few pounds of their Jelly Bean pebbles on order, which is an even larger version of the same stone.

Scored a good find at one of the big box stores while looking for building materials for the stand - this rock is nonreactive and this large bag was just $10! Looks even better wet - I'm using the darker ones to the left in the 55. The lighter ones should mix well with the smaller rock listed above and with some river rock on the property, which is a deep yellow. 

The dark rocks (shown wet here) look great with the Blue Ridge substrate for the 55!

During breaks in the weather I got hardscape options scrubbed for the 55 and are in a soaking in a mild hydrogen peroxide "dip" and saturating along with some rock candidates and foraged botanicals.

I really liked some of the rock from our property, especially the ones with the big mica lines, but I don't see them meshing well with the more traditional river rock? We have lots of granite infused with quartz and mica - lots of red clay to get off, and a fair amount of iron oxide too. The 75s will be SA biotope(ish) and do want a river feel.

Got some good wood options for the 75, will get to those after I get water in the 55 (imminent!)

We hit up the big box store over the weekend for components for the stand. Lots of debate between the Art Director and the Furniture Manufacturer (lol). We got hinges and handle hardware and were looking for birch plywood when we spotted these:

They are already glued up and sanded, almost the exact size the doors will be.... and made of TEAK! Reasonably priced too. We'll paint the rest of the cabinet (another debate between the designer and builder!) a complimentary color. Patient Spouse™ Suggested changing the handles we bought to boat cleats - whaddya think?

Things are coming together on the 55 too. Sponge filters and plants arrive tomorrow and finally found lids that fit my older tank - the H2pro lids didn't fit and had overly sharp edges. Will update on plants next post!

 

 

[Torrey]

On 4/13/2022 at 3:04 PM, Jawjagrrl said:

really liked some of the rock from our property, especially the ones with the big mica lines, but I don't see them meshing well with the more traditional river rock? We have lots of granite infused with quartz and mica - lots of red clay to get off, and a fair amount of iron oxide too. The 75s will be SA biotope(ish) and do want a river feel.

Those mica lines, if used so the lines are horizontal, can easily help you create your river feel. They will change a little when wet, and will need to be partially submerged to generate the visual effect of a flowing river. May need to glue some plants to soften the sharper edges (visually), and you will have found the secret to success. Try looking at the rocks partially submerged in the gravel with half-closed eyes, it's easier to get them arranged that way for the longer term visual after beneficial bacteria, algae, and water movement reshape the rock and gravel.

 

 

On 4/13/2022 at 3:04 PM, Jawjagrrl said:

Scored a good find at one of the big box stores while looking for building materials for the stand - this rock is nonreactive and this large bag was just $10! Looks even better wet - I'm using the darker ones to the left in the 55

I recommend looking at the aquarium science site, as a lot of the "dogma" regarding rocks and aquariums has turned out to be hogwash. I keep a couple of "reactive" rocks in my aquariums: some give the inverts a calcium source to glean, others are purely for aesthetics, and nothing we find on the surface of the earth is going to harm our water. Deep veins of iron oxide could potentially leach too much iron into the water, leaving a reddish effect.... plants will generally prevent the potential of actually damaging any inhabitants however. It's shocking just how much is actually needed to do damage, when in solid, rock state. In fact, two of my tanks are finally stabilized at 6.8 pH now that I am using as much Zero Water as I am... and they have rock that reacted strongly with acetic acid (so lots of calcium). Snails and amphipods are thriving, so I am pretty sure I found the balance between humic acid from plant matter, and calcium from rocks, and Easy Green, and livestock... because **everything** (except algae and cyanobacteria) are growing like crazy!

On 4/13/2022 at 3:04 PM, Jawjagrrl said:

They are already glued up and sanded, almost the exact size the doors will be.... and made of TEAK! Reasonably priced too. We'll paint the rest of the cabinet (another debate between the designer and builder!) a complimentary color. Patient Spouse™ Suggested changing the handles we bought to boat cleats - whaddya think?

I think the handles are perfect, and as a wood snob I honestly cringed at the idea of painting. Teak is such a gorgeous wood, and having grown up on teak decked sailboats I am a huge proponent of a proper seal over stain or paint. Painting or staining the rest of the wood to complement the teak? Absolutely!

I would buy a quality stain for the teak, however, and truly allow your cabinet to shine. Especially with the wood elements you already have planned. Pretty sure the artist's heart in you will sing when you complete this project, that teak block was a true find!

If you need any inspiration now that you have boat cleats and teak doors, ask @Streetwise for some video links or pictures. He's another sailor in our midst.

Honestly @Jawjagrrl, this is coming together beautifully. I know you wanted things to move more quickly, but if they had you wouldn't have found some of these perfect "extra" touches. Patient Spouse™ / Furniture Manufacturer™ and yourself are really raising the bar on well designed aquarium cabinetry. Might be a worthwhile sidehustle😉

[Jawjagrrl]

CHAPTER 5: Seeing Green and a Stand[ing] order

Plants and filtration arrived from the Coop yesterday, and they looked great! Packaged with care and placed in my makeshift "nursery" with Easy Green along with the red root floaters and more of my farm moss that is also acclimating to our water parameters.

Plant options for the 55 setup (which isn't a biotope of any one region):

• Pogostemon Stellatus Octopus
• Java moss
• Anubias "gold coin" x2
• Cryptocoryne Wendtii x2
• Crinum Calamistratum
• Water Sprite
• Hydrocotyle tripartita 'Japan'
• Corkscrew Sword
• Dwarf aquarium Lily
• mystery cuttings - Bacopa caroliniana or ludwigia repens?
• baby java ferns x20+
• red root floaters x100+

I got some cool emergent plant holders on Etsy to hold peace lily and pothos I was expecting from an aquabid auction... but gave up on after two weeks of not receiving my items. I think I've got plenty to work without it though and I can add later. Will be putting the DIY CO2 system to use here to give the plants a jump start and see how well it does.

So... I redid the substrate in the 55. We purchased "egg crate" for the 75s that came in 48x24 sheets, which I cut to size. The leftovers were perfect for protecting the 55 as well.

The remnant pieces were positioned in the 55 and the grids filled with some of my Dad's old meta tank era small gravel, hopefully to create lots of beneficial bacterial surfaces.

Because I want a very high area of substrate where the big tree appears in the background, I wrapped up some of my old unfortunate 90s gravel (don't judge, it was in a Victorian designed room!) in a worn out lingerie bag to provide more BB space and visual lift.

Bags of aquasoil were replaced and fertilizer capsules added - a couple opened and sprinkled over areas where tall stem plants are most likely to be placed.

Lots of arranging and a berm of sorts created using some of my old New River rock and the path in the backdrop extended into the tank space. Hopefully I can continue this illusion with the hardscape that has been cleaned and is still soaking.

Meanwhile the 75s stand moves forward in design discussion and planning. Door hinges and cleats on order. Dowel cut and glued to cover all the screw holes across the front since a lot of the 2x4 structure will be external in the completed piece. Panels will be added to the ends and center front from the inside. Plastic trim (usually used as a substitute from finish carpentry trim) will be used along with material being cut by Patient Spouse™ at work to create a "tray" floor structure that should be relatively watertight once the edges are sealed with silicone and catch small leaks from equipment, wet tools, buckets, etc.

Researched best ways to protect and maintain the teak panels for indoor use with awareness that they will get wet often as part of maintaining the tanks. Danish Oil or something similar looks like the best bet. But what about the rest of the cabinet? Paint made sense since it's mostly 2x4s. Lots of discussion on color as we decide this weekend. The house is based on a 1690s New England design and colonial colors are used throughout. More color cues taken from a family map from the period and leave us with some finalists.

 

Realistically most of the cabinet will be the doors, but the ends and rails will show this chosen color. We even looked up colors used cabin furniture on sailing ships of the period and the marked swatches are typical there as well (cream and straw also popular, but not in consideration). I'll be scaping the 55 while Patient Spouse™ keeps this moving forward this weekend. Paint duty falls to me next week. Ever the optimist, PS thinks we could have this in the room next weekend 🙂 A lot of variables that could come into play to extend that, but if this happens, great! Hopefully the 55 is wet by Monday - between a sponge I've been seeding for two weeks, another filter I plan to replace in a running tank, poopy fish water from weekend maintenance and Fritz bottled BB if needed, it should cycle quickly. 

In the meantime, I thought PS deserved recognition for his support. His vehicle had tattered remnants of the kids' college stickers on the back glass. Besides sentimentality, he didn't want to remove the scraps left because it was his way to find his common vehicle in a parking lot. So while he was working on the stand last night, I cleaned them off and left him a surprise... a "fun angelfish" tanks to the Coop plant order 🙂 (Murphy is for me!)

In the meantime, my current tanks still need care, and all is well. Happy shrimp, tetras, loaches, rasboras, endlers and their fry, etc. Trying to reduce the amount of snails and duckweed in the nano tanks and that means treats for chickens! The girls got an early Easter treat today in the form of a bunch of both. Hope everyone has a lovely weekend.

 

 

Edited April 15, 2022 by Jawjagrrl