mrsjoannh13 Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 Sooooo.... I am in the wonderful phase of planning a new tank (20 gallon) and starting to research what fish I should add! Yay! It will be a planted tank and tankmates will be 7 small cory cats, a few amano shrimp and 1 or 2 nerite snails. Thoughts I've had so far are: male female pair of apistogrammas (cacautoides maybe?) dwarf powder blue gourami group of green neon tetras dwarf neon rainbowfish German blue ram (although I think they require too high of a water temp for the corydoras) Any thoughts on these? Suggestions for others I should consider? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GameCzar Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 Well I can't NOT recommend guppies. 😉 We like our green neons, and I'd love to have a gourami tank someday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kurt Brutting Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 I like the apisto’s especially apistogramma agassizii fire red or gold fire. MD Fish Tanks did a video on the fire red and it was beautiful! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 8:26 AM, mrsjoannh13 said: 7 small cory cats, a few amano shrimp and 1 or 2 nerite snails. Thoughts I've had so far are: male female pair of apistogrammas (cacautoides maybe?) dwarf powder blue gourami group of green neon tetras dwarf neon rainbowfish German blue ram (although I think they require too high of a water temp for the corydoras) Any thoughts on these? Suggestions for others I should consider? Thanks! It sounds like the ones you've already decided on tend to stay on the sides and bottom of the tank. So maybe something that prefers the open water? I've never had apistos, but I'm thinking they stay toward the bottom, and the others like being up in the middle. Not sure. Something that has helped me is to write down all the water parameters needed by the ones I know I want, then look at where the overlap is. Then pick new tank mates that can be healthy inside of the overlap you've already got. An easy example is your mention of temperature. I'm thinking the max temp of your 3 species is around 78? So if, for example, you added a species that needs to be at 76+, you've got a super narrow temp range to try to control. The wider you can make your parameter ranges for a tank, the easier it is to maintain. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 2, 2022 Author Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 10:06 AM, CalmedByFish said: It sounds like the ones you've already decided on tend to stay on the sides and bottom of the tank. So maybe something that prefers the open water? I've never had apistos, but I'm thinking they stay toward the bottom, and the others like being up in the middle. Not sure. Something that has helped me is to write down all the water parameters needed by the ones I know I want, then look at where the overlap is. Then pick new tank mates that can be healthy inside of the overlap you've already got. An easy example is your mention of temperature. I'm thinking the max temp of your 3 species is around 78? So if, for example, you added a species that needs to be at 76+, you've got a super narrow temp range to try to control. The wider you can make your parameter ranges for a tank, the easier it is to maintain. Well definitely taking space in the tank as a consideration (since I've got corys and snails mainly at the bottom, would prefer mid to top of tank for new fish - so good point about apistos!). I do have a little chart going with water temp, peaceful/aggressive, tank size, etc to make sure I get something compatible. I think I'm leaning against the rams based on temp. I have naturally high pH so maybe the tetras would be best? Meets the mid to top of tank requirement and will be fine with similar temps as the corys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gideyon Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 Would you consider the honey gourami? If I had a warmer room, I'd have that in a 10-20 gallon as my centerpiece. You could also do a single male plakat betta if the temp was at least 75. I know the recommended is 78 min, but I've seen them thrive in a 75 degree community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 10:10 AM, mrsjoannh13 said: Well definitely taking space in the tank as a consideration (since I've got corys and snails mainly at the bottom, would prefer mid to top of tank for new fish - so good point about apistos!). I do have a little chart going with water temp, peaceful/aggressive, tank size, etc to make sure I get something compatible. I think I'm leaning against the rams based on temp. I have naturally high pH so maybe the tetras would be best? Meets the mid to top of tank requirement and will be fine with similar temps as the corys. Yeah, the main thing that steered me away from rams is the temp. I had it in my head that tetras need a pH that is low or in the low 7's. Could be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 2, 2022 Author Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 10:25 AM, Gideyon said: Would you consider the honey gourami? If I had a warmer room, I'd have that in a 10-20 gallon as my centerpiece. You could also do a single male plakat betta if the temp was at least 75. I know the recommended is 78 min, but I've seen them thrive in a 75 degree community. I've got honey gourami on my short list, yes. I have a betta in the tank now with the corydoras, shrimp and snails. They have peacefully coexisted for the past year, but I am moving the betta into my second 20g tank so he can live out his senior years in blissful betta solitude. When I had him by himself in a 10g tank when I first got him (maybe 2-3 months during quarantine) he seemed much happier and healthier.... making bubble nests and was super friendly. Now he's pretty skittish and no bubble nests 😞. On 1/2/2022 at 10:26 AM, CalmedByFish said: Yeah, the main thing that steered me away from rams is the temp. I had it in my head that tetras need a pH that is low or in the low 7's. Could be wrong. You're right about that actually (the pH for tetras). Mistake on my part. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Levi_Aquatics Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 I have to recommend guppies as they are colorful, swim in all levels of the aquarium, and breed easily. I currently have a 20L with guppies and kuli loaches that I am enjoying a lot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 2, 2022 Author Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 11:02 AM, Levi_Aquatics said: I have to recommend guppies as they are colorful, swim in all levels of the aquarium, and breed easily. I currently have a 20L with guppies and kuli loaches that I am enjoying a lot. Guppies were not on my radar, but I'm definitely adding them to the list! I think they'd be a good option considering my water parameters, tank size and tank mates. Appreciate it and keep those suggestions coming! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 11:09 AM, mrsjoannh13 said: Appreciate it and keep those suggestions coming! Endlers might be worth looking at, just because they're similar to guppies, but usually more durable. You could even compromise by getting a guppy-endler hybrid. A small shoal of platies would have their needs met by that tank. A quick google of something like "platy types images" would give you a quick overview of options. And since you mentioned dwarf powder blue gouramis, I hear several females can live together. I think female powder blues can live with female honeys - not certain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 2, 2022 Author Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 12:49 PM, CalmedByFish said: Endlers might be worth looking at, just because they're similar to guppies, but usually more durable. You could even compromise by getting a guppy-endler hybrid. A small shoal of platies would have their needs met by that tank. A quick google of something like "platy types images" would give you a quick overview of options. And since you mentioned dwarf powder blue gouramis, I hear several females can live together. I think female powder blues can live with female honeys - not certain. I'll look more into Endlers and platys - thanks! Regarding gouramis, I'm just concerned about the tank size and current stock. I think I would need a few dwarf gouramis together, correct? Or would one be happy by its lonesome in a tank with corys, shrimp and snails? It's only 20 gallons so I wouldn't want to overstock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 2, 2022 Share Posted January 2, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 12:51 PM, mrsjoannh13 said: I think I would need a few dwarf gouramis together, correct? Or would one be happy by its lonesome in a tank with corys, shrimp and snails? Not speaking from experience, but I'm pretty sure gouramis can go solo, much like a betta can. I think that's a common way to house males, particularly. If you're interested in having a single gourami, I'd say that's worth the time to research. It seems promising. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laritheloud Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) I'm going to recommend against dwarf praecox rainbowfish and powder blue dwarf gouramis. The rainbowfish will need more space, and I have 0 doubts you will start to see troublesome agitation and nipping behavior because they want room to swim and be the active little fish they are. Powder blue dwarf gouramis and any other Trichogaster Lalius colorways (except wild caught fish, which are incredibly hard to find) are genetically weak. They're susceptible to all kinds of illness and tend to come in harboring Dwarf Gourami Iridovirus, which is an invariably fatal condition. They're also quite a bit more aggressive than the literature will have you think, and it's absolutely not recommended to have more than one in a tank. Years of selective line-breeding has really messed with this fish, unfortunately, and most aquarists cannot get more than 6 to 12 months out of their dwarf gouramis (without any other gouramis in the tank) even after bombing them with medications in quarantine. Be prepared and know what you're getting into if you choose a dwarf gourami as your fish. Fortunately, you have a lot of other great options that are similar to dwarf gouramis but much healthier. For example, I'd definitely recommend a small group of honey gouramis (trichogaster chuna), ideally one male to two or three females. Another alternative is a sunset thicklip gourami (trichogaster labiosa, totally orange with a clear tail, doesn't matter which sex you buy) -- just one for a 20 gallon -- which is like a more outgoing, slightly bigger, ever-so-slightly more dominating fish than a shyer honey gourami. If you can get a wild coloration thicklip, they're even prettier, in my opinion, but quite hard to source in the USA. If you have the soft, acidic water for it, chocolate gouramis, licorice gouramis, and samurai gouramis are all absolutely stunning and very unusual fish. They do have special needs and need water with a Ph of 6 or less, so if you want something a bit easier, I'd go for something else. For rams, I'd try a Bolivian Ram over a German Blue. Hardier fish and they can handle slightly cooler temps than German Rams. Hope this helps you out! EDIT: I keep a bachelor tank of Endlers and I agree, they're a delight and quite hardy. Fun little swirling masses of bright colors for sure. They will breed like crazy if you get females, though. I kind of wish I did get a breeding trio, and if I were to do my tank over I'd do that! I also have a super soft spot for platies and I'm dreaming of raising a livebearer tank for them. Edited January 3, 2022 by laritheloud 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 I agree with everyone who has said male Endlers and Guppies (so you don't reproduce- because we all know that they will and prolifically). Since I've added them to my tanks they are more interesting and lively- they are individuals and groups and every one has a different personality. I know this recommendation is not for everyone and I've not kept them yet but I'm really interested in keeping Blind Cave Tetras, they tolerate pH as high as 9 and I just think they are so neat having adapted without eyes. They would be peaceful with everyone- would just have to make sure nobody bullied them, guppies and endlers certainly wouldn't. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 8:05 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: I agree with everyone who has said male Endlers and Guppies (so you don't reproduce- because we all know that they will and prolifically). I am leaning towards guppies or endlers. I was thinking of getting males & females because I've never had fish babies before. I know they will multiply like crazy but I've always wanted something of mine to breed but nothing in my 18 or so months of fish keeping. I've only got skirt tetras (another tank) and cory cats and a sole male betta. But I was hoping the tetras or corys would have had a love child or two by now. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 @mrsjoannh13 I think that's a good pick, you will enjoy them. I would say if you want to breed make sure you have someone to sell them off to. Not every LFS takes Guppies or Endlers (especially hybrids)- they're very common- so good to check first. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexi B Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 Betta. No other fish, only Betta. They're the best fish! Just kidding, but as a lover of Bettas I also love gouramis! Sunset honey gourami would be my pick. They can be moody, but to my understanding are more partial to other fish than other gourami species. Especially if they're more bottom swimmers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 You’ve got a lot of great recommendations so far. I’ll add one more to check out. The Bolivian Ram is very similar to the German Blue Ram but it tolerates lower temps. I haven’t kept them myself but the ones I’ve seen at Aquarium co-op are super cool. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardedbillygoat1975 Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 @Patrick_Ggreat choice - they are like little earth eater cichlids, tons of personality wi the out the homicidal ideation of bigger cichlids. I think that Endlers are my favorite Poecilia species in that they are much more temp tolerant and hardier than guppies. Have fun and enjoy the ride! 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrsjoannh13 Posted January 3, 2022 Author Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 8:17 PM, Lexi B said: Betta. No other fish, only Betta. They're the best fish! Just kidding, but as a lover of Bettas I also love gouramis! Sunset honey gourami would be my pick. They can be moody, but to my understanding are more partial to other fish than other gourami species. Especially if they're more bottom swimmers You know, I am a big fan of male bettas. So much so that it's the reason I'm getting another tank. Honestly, I could have 5 or 6 cubes with a male betta in each one. Probably my favorite freshwater fish. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 1/2/2022 at 6:36 PM, laritheloud said: Powder blue dwarf gouramis and any other Trichogaster Lalius colorways (except wild caught fish, which are incredibly hard to find) are genetically weak. They're susceptible to all kinds of illness and tend to come in harboring Dwarf Gourami Iridovirus, which is an invariably fatal condition. Thanks for mentioning this. My new powder blue is marked online as "being processed" today, so I'll get myself clued in about that virus. On 1/2/2022 at 8:08 PM, mrsjoannh13 said: I am leaning towards guppies or endlers. I was thinking of getting males & females because I've never had fish babies before. I know they will multiply like crazy but I've always wanted something of mine to breed It is fun! I have a suggestion aimed at long-term good. You could get only 1 or 2 females, put your very favorite male with her/them for a week, then just wait. When in great conditions and old enough, endlers give birth about every 3.5 weeks - that's pretty often! The fry that turn out to be male will probably be easy enough to keep, but the females get more out of control since they're larger and will eventually become fry-making machines. Maybe this way, you could have the joy without the overwhelm. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
laritheloud Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 @CalmedByFish I've heard anecdotal success with gouramis by administering an intense round of treatments for gill flukes for dwarf gouramis in quarantine. I don't know if this is actually something that will help your gourami live a longer, happier life, but just something I've picked up along the way. I hope you end up with a healthy little guy. They really are such beautiful fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Intuos Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 1/3/2022 at 2:05 AM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: I know this recommendation is not for everyone and I've not kept them yet but I'm really interested in keeping Blind Cave Tetras, they tolerate pH as high as 9 and I just think they are so neat having adapted without eyes. They would be peaceful with everyone The problem I found with the blind cave tetra is they were fin nippers and surprisingly didn't mix well with other fish. A pair of apistogramma or dwarf gourami would both work well. I personally feel the apistogramma tend to be a bit shy compared to the gourami, but I prefer the colours. So depends on your preference. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalmedByFish Posted January 3, 2022 Share Posted January 3, 2022 On 1/3/2022 at 12:20 PM, laritheloud said: @CalmedByFish I've heard anecdotal success with gouramis by administering an intense round of treatments for gill flukes for dwarf gouramis in quarantine. It should be that gill flukes are visible, right? So I wouldn't need to medicate as a prophylactic? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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