Stocking questions

[abbie]

Hi everyone! I am new to the hobby and have started thinking about a second tank. I'm thinking about doing a 30 gallon planted tank with either 1 or 3 German blue rams (if 3 I'd do 1 male and 2 females), around 10 rummy nose tetras, 6 otos ( I may do 3 to make sure there's enough food between algae and me feeding), and 6 kuhli loaches. My tap water comes out with no nitrites, no nitrates, an 8.4 ph, around 25 ppm GH and 180ppm KH. I am thinking I could heat the tank to 84 degrees and keep everyone happy. Has anyone done something similar to this and have any advice? I am still researching so if anyone has any other suggestions for a community I would love to hear!

[Minanora]

Bring on the guppies! Just kidding; but I have to go there. 😛

 

Rams are so cool! I look forward to seeing what you decide to do. What do you have in your current tank?

[abbie]

On 11/30/2021 at 3:11 PM, Minanora said:

Bring on the guppies! Just kidding; but I have to go there. 😛

 

Rams are so cool! I look forward to seeing what you decide to do. What do you have in your current tank?

I thought about doing guppies! My only concern was since they're livebearers I am concerned about possibly getting over run by them haha I also sadly don't have a lfs within an hour or two of me to sell them to. Could you think of a fish that would eat the fry but leave the adults alone? 

[Minanora]

On 11/30/2021 at 3:59 PM, abbie said:

I thought about doing guppies! My only concern was since they're livebearers I am concerned about possibly getting over run by them haha I also sadly don't have a lfs within an hour or two of me to sell them to. Could you think of a fish that would eat the fry but leave the adults alone? 

I  have no idea what you're talking about with being over run with babies... They only have 20+ babies at a time, every 3.5 weeks or so. I mean, I only have 130ish babies right now. I'm not drowning, I swear. 😛 Yeah it can be a problem if you keep both males and females. I let mine have babies outside of a breeding net and hoped that other tank mates would eat them. I can say, well fed swordtails, tetras, other guppies, don't eat enough of them to make a difference in my tanks. I watched a swordtail eat two or three, but it wasn't enough.... Rams will eat babies, dwarf cichlids, there's a few others. But I'm not sure about the species behaviours with the adult guppies/swordtails/mollies/platies and other live bearers. I've only ever kept angelfish with guppies in the past. I wasn't breeding guppies at that time though. I just always say Guppies because I love them so much.

I do think you could get away with keeping your tank closer to 82 with your current stocking idea. Other than that I like your list you have personally.

[PineSong]

Wouldn't rams eat guppies, though? The guppies I bought recently came very chewed up because they were in a tank with rams.

If  you only buy male guppies, you will not have offspring. Lots of sellers, including Aquahuna, sell packs of males, and my local LFS and box stores have many more males than females.

[Chad]

My first foray into guppies was a male only tank. I had issues with aggression early on which can happen with male only tanks. But it likely had to do with them being in a 9 gallon tank and only guppies were in it. A 30 gallon tank with lots of other species might just be the ticket to curb the fin nipping issues I had.

[JettsPapa]

On 11/30/2021 at 3:05 PM, abbie said:

Hi everyone! I am new to the hobby and have started thinking about a second tank. I'm thinking about doing a 30 gallon planted tank with either 1 or 3 German blue rams (if 3 I'd do 1 male and 2 females), around 10 rummy nose tetras, 6 otos ( I may do 3 to make sure there's enough food between algae and me feeding), and 6 kuhli loaches. My tap water comes out with no nitrites, no nitrates, an 8.4 ph, around 25 ppm GH and 180ppm KH. I am thinking I could heat the tank to 84 degrees and keep everyone happy. Has anyone done something similar to this and have any advice? I am still researching so if anyone has any other suggestions for a community I would love to hear!

Hello,

I haven't kept German blue rams, but from following fish forums for quite a while I wouldn't recommend that stocking with your water.  They prefer considerably warmer water than most commonly kept fish (low to mid 80's F), and soft, low pH water.  Bolivian rams might work better.

I'd also discourage you from getting otos.  They're notoriously difficult to keep alive.  Almost all the ones sold commercially are wild caught, and since they often won't eat commercial fish food they have often suffered irreparable harm to their digestive systems from starvation before they reach the store.  I think I went through five before I gave up on them.  I only had one live longer than a week (though it thrived for a long time), and I've seen many similar reports.

[abbie]

On 12/2/2021 at 8:09 AM, JettsPapa said:

Hello,

I haven't kept German blue rams, but from following fish forums for quite a while I wouldn't recommend that stocking with your water.  They prefer considerably warmer water than most commonly kept fish (low to mid 80's F), and soft, low pH water.  Bolivian rams might work better.

I'd also discourage you from getting otos.  They're notoriously difficult to keep alive.  Almost all the ones sold commercially are wild caught, and since they often won't eat commercial fish food they have often suffered irreparable harm to their digestive systems from starvation before they reach the store.  I think I went through five before I gave up on them.  I only had one live longer than a week (though it thrived for a long time), and I've seen many similar reports.

Thank you for your thoughts! I just did a very quick google search on Bolivians and it sounds like they like being around 74-78 are they typically okay being closer to 78? I am in Texas so its pretty warm here in general😅 I will definitely do more research on them though!

Oh otos may not be the best idea for me right now since I am so new to the hobby. Are there any other smaller algae eaters you would recommend me looking into that aren't supper hard on plants?

The more research I do the more I realize community tanks may be a game of tetris 😅

On 12/1/2021 at 7:08 PM, Chad said:

My first foray into guppies was a male only tank. I had issues with aggression early on which can happen with male only tanks. But it likely had to do with them being in a 9 gallon tank and only guppies were in it. A 30 gallon tank with lots of other species might just be the ticket to curb the fin nipping issues I had.

Would the plants also help break up the aggression so they each have their own spot?

On 12/1/2021 at 11:53 AM, PineSong said:

Wouldn't rams eat guppies, though? The guppies I bought recently came very chewed up because they were in a tank with rams.

If  you only buy male guppies, you will not have offspring. Lots of sellers, including Aquahuna, sell packs of males, and my local LFS and box stores have many more males than females.

I didn't know you could buy only males. An all male tank would make my life easier so I'm not over run with guppy babies🤔😅

[Chad]

On 12/2/2021 at 11:54 AM, abbie said:

Would the plants also help break up the aggression so they each have their own spot?

I didn't find that to be the case. But again, I believe my issues won't translate to your situation. Your tank is bigger and other species will keep them distracted from one another, at least I would think that to be the case. Aggression's worth watching for but not worrying over. 

[abbie]

On 12/2/2021 at 12:03 PM, Chad said:

I didn't find that to be the case. But again, I believe my issues won't translate to your situation. Your tank is bigger and other species will keep them distracted from one another, at least I would think that to be the case. Aggression's worth watching for but not worrying over. 

Awesome thank you for the information! I've got a lot to research😅

[Chad]

On 12/2/2021 at 12:09 PM, abbie said:

Awesome thank you for the information! I've got a lot to research😅

No problem, and don't overthink your decisions too much. Yes, you'll likely make a few missteps, please understand it's unavoidable and they're not the end of the world either. This is a great forum and I've learned a ton from a lot of great and generous people here. You've come to the right place, you have a good plan, and you'll do great!

[Minanora]

On 12/2/2021 at 10:03 AM, Chad said:

I didn't find that to be the case. But again, I believe my issues won't translate to your situation. Your tank is bigger and other species will keep them distracted from one another, at least I would think that to be the case. Aggression's worth watching for but not worrying over. 

I keep a male guppy only community tank with other species. I have a 75G for this. I do not have issues with my 7 males. When I had 3 males only, I did. Higher numbers seem to curb the issues, especially with other fish to distract the males. My notorious problem boy, Paco, does like to dance and chase the other males on occasion, but he gives up and goes about his business after a while. He was much worse with females in the tank, he chased one female so much that she injured herself badly. At one time I kept males and females together. Even with 8 females to 3 males, Paco was a problem. He was relentless in his pursuit. Now that I have 7 males in there, I haven't seen any issues. I keep harlequin rasboras, corydoras, otos, a swordtail pair, and some amano shrimp with the male guppies.

A temperature of 78 would be great imo. I keep my tanks between 76 and 78. The only warmer tank is my fry grow-out tank which is at 80.

Don't be too put off by otos, read up on them, watch the Co-Op video regarding Otocinclus, weigh your options. They can be poorly treated by importers and wholesalers in many cases, but you can find good ones. Plus, if you buy them you're giving them a chance to live a good life. So long as you understand what you're in for.  Never be afraid to ask lots of questions. I bought my otos from a local fish shop and had a lengthy discussion with the staff prior to purchasing them. I also made sure I knew how long they had been keeping them prior to my purchasing them, what they were feeding them, and I made sure to buy ones that were showing full tummies and playing a lot. I got one straggler that I was sure wasn't going to make it, I was right, and the store replaced him for me since I had expressed my concern that he wouldn't make it since he was very thin at the time of purchase.

[JettsPapa]

On 12/2/2021 at 11:54 AM, abbie said:

Thank you for your thoughts! I just did a very quick google search on Bolivians and it sounds like they like being around 74-78 are they typically okay being closer to 78? I am in Texas so its pretty warm here in general😅 I will definitely do more research on them though!

Oh otos may not be the best idea for me right now since I am so new to the hobby. Are there any other smaller algae eaters you would recommend me looking into that aren't supper hard on plants?

I don't want to keep being a wet blanket, but using fish to control algae in aquariums is kinda putting a band aid on the problem.  Controlling algae by balancing light and nutrients is generally a better option.  However, if you want to get one anyway, you might investigate Siamese algae eaters or bristle nose plecos.

[abbie]

On 12/2/2021 at 1:09 PM, JettsPapa said:

I don't want to keep being a wet blanket, but using fish to control algae in aquariums is kinda putting a band aid on the problem.  Controlling algae by balancing light and nutrients is generally a better option.  However, if you want to get one anyway, you might investigate Siamese algae eaters or bristle nose plecos.

I'll look into those! I started looking into otos because I think they look cool and I like how they behave. I would probably be interested in one even if they didn't eat algae that's just a bonus for me 😅

[drewzero1]

Depending on where you need algae control, I've always kept nerite snails and never had to clean the glass. Mine never touched my plants (for better or worse). I like nerites because they don't reproduce, and snails in general because they don't tend to interact with other tank inhabitants. (Aside from loaches and puffers, and other snail-eating fish.)

Like @JettsPapasaid, light and nutrients are the real solution to algae. If you do end up deciding to go with otos, wait until the tank already has a good amount of algae so they have something to eat right away. Also, I seem to remember that otos only eat certain kinds of algae.

[abbie]

On 12/2/2021 at 2:23 PM, drewzero1 said:

Depending on where you need algae control, I've always kept nerite snails and never had to clean the glass. Mine never touched my plants (for better or worse). I like nerites because they don't reproduce, and snails in general because they don't tend to interact with other tank inhabitants. (Aside from loaches and puffers, and other snail-eating fish.)

Like @JettsPapasaid, light and nutrients are the real solution to algae. If you do end up deciding to go with otos, wait until the tank already has a good amount of algae so they have something to eat right away. Also, I seem to remember that otos only eat certain kinds of algae.

I've got I think 4 nerites right now and I absolutely love them since they deal with my bettas nonsense and they'll probably end up in the next tank🥳 My issue right now is getting algae off of my plants mainly my water sprite and the nerites want nothing to do with it 

[Minanora]

On 12/2/2021 at 11:09 AM, JettsPapa said:

I don't want to keep being a wet blanket, but using fish to control algae in aquariums is kinda putting a band aid on the problem.  Controlling algae by balancing light and nutrients is generally a better option.  However, if you want to get one anyway, you might investigate Siamese algae eaters or bristle nose plecos.

Hey, wet blankets put out fires. Personally I don't think you're a wet blanket, just making good observations, recommendations, and comments. 🙂

I agree: Light and nutrient balance are indeed best for algae control. My experience, My otos eat some algae but they actually like to go feed on my corydora food and pretend they're corydoras... Vacuuming up brine shrimp and fallen pellets around the bottom. I keep the lights on way too long for the fry, so I have a bit of algae and plenty of snails. Bladder snails and pond snails.

In my 20g, my clown pleco does nothing for the algae. He's spoiled and gets repashy twice a week. Plus he eats corydora pellets and anything else he can vacuum off of the substrate, and, he snacks on my crypts.