Can an old dog learn shrimp tricks? A new shrimpkeeper's journal

[dmurray407]

On 10/6/2021 at 10:35 AM, JettsPapa said:

Below is some basic advice I wrote up for beginning neocaridina shrimp keepers.  You might find it useful.

• Shrimp are sensitive to copper in the water, though the small amounts in commercial fish and shrimp food won't hurt them.

JettsPapa, a question about copper. A few years ago, we had a very persistent ich outbreak and we used an assortment of "cures" for it (I don't remember what we used, but it was all stuff available at Walmart). Not sure if any contained copper  and the water and filter media have been changed out many times since then (I think I also changed the substrate out since then)-before getting shrimp, should I treat with Cuprasorb as a precaution?

[Guppysnail]

On 10/28/2021 at 12:03 PM, dmurray407 said:

-do I need to quarantine shrimp before putting them in my big tank?

Shrimp and inverts do not carry diseases that can affect fish. You DO need to quarantine shrimp. They carry many things that you do not want in your tank because if they carry them and it wipes out your colony it has potential to infect future colonies. It is much easier to treat for these things if they are quarantined and not treating your entire tank and stressing your other inhabitants. These will also be easier to see in a small quarantine. You also want to make sure they transition well from shipping and to your parameters and dead shrimp are hard to find in planted tanks. Here is a link I’m not sure how great the article is but the names and descriptions match what I know of shrimp. https://aquariumbreeder.com/understanding-dwarf-shrimp-diseases-and-parasites/

On 10/29/2021 at 9:02 AM, dmurray407 said:

JettsPapa, a question about copper. A few years ago, we had a very persistent ich outbreak and we used an assortment of "cures" for it (I don't remember what we used, but it was all stuff available at Walmart). Not sure if any contained copper  and the water and filter media have been changed out many times since then (I think I also changed the substrate out since then)-before getting shrimp, should I treat with Cuprasorb as a precaution?

Buy an api copper test test that is how to determine. You also want to know how much copper is in your source water. Mine has some so I must be very careful with foods containing copper sulfate. I still use them to no detriment but limit the amount of those types. 

Edited October 29, 2021 by Guppysnail

[JettsPapa]

On 10/29/2021 at 8:02 AM, dmurray407 said:

JettsPapa, a question about copper. A few years ago, we had a very persistent ich outbreak and we used an assortment of "cures" for it (I don't remember what we used, but it was all stuff available at Walmart). Not sure if any contained copper  and the water and filter media have been changed out many times since then (I think I also changed the substrate out since then)-before getting shrimp, should I treat with Cuprasorb as a precaution?

It looks like @Guppysnail answered better than I could.

[Jawjagrrl]

So this morning I found it a bit odd that 2/3rds of my shrimp were in the up front "beach area" of my tank. I have a large saddle orange that appears to have gone through molt over the last hour or two as I found another shrimp enjoying the shed shell. 

That's all fine, then I see some kind of worm free-swimming mid water - and it's longer than the adult shrimp. Planeria? See above the shrimp here:

My research was... terrifying, especially for a fresh molt shrimp. I watched one of these worms kill an adult shrimp with a hard shell 😱 should I be worried? Nothing has been added to this tank since initial setup (which did include terrestrial moss) and shrimp. Have never seen anything at all besides bladder snails, and now suddenly a single large worm? The descriptions of these and detritus worms are always white and this is clearly brown. EDIT: It was also free-swimming in the tank before settling into the moss as shown above.

I've seen some hobbyists on YT with lush, healthy tanks with shrimp, nano fish and these worms with no issues, so just not sure how concerned to be? 

Edited October 30, 2021 by Jawjagrrl
questioning ID since it was swimming?

[Guppysnail]

Planarian are both white and brown. Yes they actively eat shrimp. My eyes are not good enough to tell but type in brown planarian pictures on google to compare. Most fish will eat the planarian keeping the numbers in checks allowing your shrimp population to thrive. If there are no fish they will slowly deteriorate your shrimp colony as their numbers grow. Planarian are like hydra and if you cut them you then have 2 planarian. 

[Jawjagrrl]

On 10/30/2021 at 2:51 PM, Guppysnail said:

Planarian are both white and brown. Yes they actively eat shrimp. My eyes are not good enough to tell but type in brown planarian pictures on google to compare. Most fish will eat the planarian keeping the numbers in checks allowing your shrimp population to thrive. If there are no fish they will slowly deteriorate your shrimp colony as their numbers grow. Planarian are like hydra and if you cut them you then have 2 planarian. 

Thanks - have been looking at the DIY trap idea. I will be adding endlers, but that's clearly not going to help in the short-term. Wondering if I would be better served to overfeed protein so they have something easy to eat that are not my shrimp since I only have a small starter colony (13).

I can have some "no-planaria" here Monday - anyone here have any experience with it?

Edited October 30, 2021 by Jawjagrrl
asking about no-planaria product

[Guppysnail]

I would not feed more protein. They reproduce very quickly and more food equals more hungry planarian. I have no experience with the no planaria 

[Jawjagrrl]

If there are planaria in the tank, I suppose it would also explain shrimp spending more time on the pre-filter sponge. Half my colony are hanging out on it, more on the glass. 

Then... I spot THIS. What the heck? It swims around like a shrimp, but it's not a shrimplet. I remember seeing something like this scurry off a plant I purchased from a FL fish farm in August, but hadn't seen it since. I had a betta in this tank for a month before the shrimp that I would have thought would love hunting it. It's quite tiny - those are my fingers behind the glass in the last image to try and get focus. 

Edited October 30, 2021 by Jawjagrrl

[Guppysnail]

That’s a scud. Harmless. Good fish food. 

[Jawjagrrl]

On 10/30/2021 at 5:02 PM, Guppysnail said:

That’s a scud. Harmless. Good fish food. 

Just found an article about them, glad that's what they are. Surprised they survived my betta that hunted shrimp like it was a job!

The same article is suggesting to me that this is not planaria, but a type of freshwater leech. Also problematic for shrimp and medicating for them problematic. But the same traps that work for planaria work for them too, so looks like I'll be doing some DIY.

[Guppysnail]

Scuds multiply extremely rapidly. Your betta probably was chowing down. They burrow into the substrate and eat leftovers. Best of luck with your leeches. Let us know how you make out. 

[Jawjagrrl]

Didn't catch any leeches/planeria last night, but lots of activity in the tank today. I sure hope this a molt in progress as everyone looks really good including this guy this morning. A similarly sized shrimp molted 24 hours prior. Just found him twitching on his side, then like this:

There's also love in the air with multiple females with saddles. Didn't think my yellows were mature enough to make the attempt until I saw this:

They remained like this for several minutes (she also enjoyed a snack during). She then bucked him off, and last I saw this was happening:

Everyone else was enjoying a snack.

Saw a couple more scuds on high zoom, so my endlers should have something to look forward to when they join the tank.

Edited October 31, 2021 by Jawjagrrl

[Jawjagrrl]

😔 Lost jade shrimp shortly after previous post. Failed molt? Lower body had a yellow cast under the shell, overall looked larger than the days previous. 

[Guppysnail]

I am so sorry 😢 Possible failed moot. Did the body look milky white? Looking at your picture close my eyes are not great but it seems it might have been. The carapace portion seems swollen and milky looking. Here is a useful article. Their pictures match the ones I have personal experience with. Scroll down to milk shrimp disease. But this is a useful link to help quickly identify shrimp issues with decent pictures https://aquariumbreeder.com/understanding-dwarf-shrimp-diseases-and-parasites/

[Jawjagrrl]

On 11/1/2021 at 6:03 AM, Guppysnail said:

I am so sorry 😢 Possible failed moot. Did the body look milky white? Looking at your picture close my eyes are not great but it seems it might have been. The carapace portion seems swollen and milky looking. Here is a useful article. Their pictures match the ones I have personal experience with. Scroll down to milk shrimp disease. But this is a useful link to help quickly identify shrimp issues with decent pictures https://aquariumbreeder.com/understanding-dwarf-shrimp-diseases-and-parasites/

thanks for this. I am paranoid about the planaria or leech situation and trying to not see every problem as a nail in need of a hammer. I had figured this shrimp was likely male, pretty streamlined through the body. But in these last images the body is much fuller and I was seeing translucence in the ends of the legs and tail, so I thought I was observing the "puffing up" with water prior to a molt. He had been in moving around a lot as well. He didn't look milky white so much as a pale spring green, especially the lower body. I've had three other molts that I know of in the last week so it wouldn't surprise me. I really liked this one and his gold back stripe and I'm left with a single jade now that is very deep in color and no stripe, perhaps closer to the wild type. 

[Jawjagrrl]

Update: Been a busy week, little time to read or post. But shrimp doing well, parameters good. And they got new friends on Wednesday, all the way from Seattle to NE Georgia in less than 48 hours! 

Meet the endlers - in motion blur. Anyone that gets good photos of endlers, I am impressed. Even at 32x shutter speed, I still can't get good images.

9/10 arrived safely and went through a lengthy acclimation from that soft Seattle water my my 7.6 and hard water in the shrimp tank. It arrived at 6.6! They all did fine, however.. 

I purchased assorted Male endlers. Expected 1" fish like my chili rasboras... but no. The largest is easily 2". Did I actually get guppy endler hybrids?  Would love input from the endler/guppy keepers out there...

We couldn't decide on a specific endler type which is why we went with an assortment, and the colors and patterns are amazing. They really look luminescent in the tank, especially during siesta light periods when only the kitchen counter light hits the tank.

Interestingly, the shrimp are almost more visible than before. Perhaps the presence of these guys makes them feel safer that big predators won't appear?

My snowball shrimp, OG, dropped her first eggs a couple of weeks ago - she is still fanning her phantom clutch. Wonder if she'll continue to do so for another month?

Despite being a bit crowded right now - I may move some of the larger fish into a betta setup after they've quarantined in this one for a few weeks - everyone seems to be doing well. This tank is the new favorite of our fish watching cat because of all the flashy colors and movement. 🙂

 

Edited November 7, 2021 by Jawjagrrl
emphasis on endler question

[Jawjagrrl]

We have first successful shrimp "berries"! Hopefully shrimplets for the holidays 🤩🎅

[Jawjagrrl]

Looks like shrimplets soon! Eggs were moved on Nov 9, how close do my fellow shrimpers think she is? 

Interested in thoughts about the offspring as a first gen cross if a bloody mary male isn't the baby daddy? - there alre also orange, yellow, blue dream and jade males in this tank.

Meanwhile it seems like others are in the proverbial waiting room. OG has a saddle again after losing her first eggs.

Happy with the way the tank is maturing overall. Some concerns as we enter the cold months about keeping the temp consistent. The kitchen has east facing windows and the temp can get as low (in the room) as 58-60 overnight then reach 70 when the sun rises. My tiny heater will make the tank 80+ overnight so I've been doing a lot of on/off. Would I be better to leave it unheated and in the 60s most of the time?

The place I get my cat/dog food HD a nice sale on small cholla wood, so I picked up some. They seem to really like it and hopefully will be a good hiding spot for shrimplets along with the floating plants. A little concerned about the scuds eating them - I have adults now that are larger than I imagined.

I have another pregnant cherry shrimp, not sure how far along.

Any advice for a first time keeper of shrimplets? Tank parameters seem good, no ammonia, nitrites, low nitrates. Ph 7.6, moderately hard (280-300). Need to test GH but it was decent at last test. I think I'm ready?

[Guppysnail]

Congrats. If it’s a long running seasoned tank no worries they will have food where they stay/hang. If it’s a newer tank sprinkle powdered fry food in as shrimplettes stay where they hatch for awhile and need the food to come to them. Other than that treat them just like the parents. 

[Jawjagrrl]

On 12/1/2021 at 8:26 PM, Guppysnail said:

Congrats. If it’s a long running seasoned tank no worries they will have food where they stay/hang. If it’s a newer tank sprinkle powdered fry food in as shrimplettes stay where they hatch for awhile and need the food to come to them. Other than that treat them just like the parents. 

Thanks! This was first set up in August, so not entirely new. Lots of biofilm on surfaces, etc. I do have some of the Co-op fry food for my chilis, so I can use that. I think they will love all the floating plants (the scuds sure do). 

Out of a dozen shrimp, I currently have FOUR pregnant now! OG successfully moved eggs overnight. Plus I saw breeding behavior this morning from two more that I thought were still too immature, so I guess they are happy with their environment 🙂 

Edited December 2, 2021 by Jawjagrrl
Added photos

[Jawjagrrl]

As Christmas gets closer, so too does the prospect of shrimplets! I had several mamas-to-be hiding in cholla wood yesterday and wondered if babies were happening! Not yet, but I do believe I can start to see eye spots in some of the orange shrimp eggs today:

I am normally not one to use decorations, but I couldn't resist this aquatic version of Charlie Brown's Christmas Tree (that I related most to Linus in that special tells you what sort of kid I was in the early 70s).

It's really too big for a 2.5 or 5gal, but I am using anyway. I love seeing the endlers congregating under it and when the shrimp sit on the ball. 

Cory asked on YT about gifts for pets and that he had an idea - I posted there that if he were to market something the right size for true nano tanks (under 10gal) I think he'd have an exclusive. Have never seen any truly small enough unless your tank is unplanted.

Speaking of plants, my dwarf lily and cornes have really taken off over the last month. I finally got to use my aquascaping scissors to trim off a couple of lily leaves because the endlers were running low on swimming room. I got a single leaf of some sort of floating plant (not duckweed) with one of these plants in August, now I have enough to cover the tops of all three tanks with a bunch more in a bucket! The shrimp mamas really enjoy the floating plants and will keep for babies to enjoy. The scuds enjoy them too.

[Jawjagrrl]

Getting so close! I can see more eyes today. She has been carrying them since Nov 9th. She is first, but not alone...

another cherry is holding, and I believe a blue dream and a gold are too. 

How many shrimp *can* live in a 2.5 gal? It's my happiest tank to my surprise.

[eatyourpeas]

Just caught up with this journal. The tank looks great!

On 12/12/2021 at 8:44 AM, Jawjagrrl said:

How many shrimp *can* live in a 2.5 gal? It's my happiest tank to my surprise.

I have a 6 gal. heavily occupied tank with lots of wood for my Vampire crabs. The water level is less than half way, so I am assuming less than 3 gallons minus all the displaced water by the wood. I'd say it is a 2 gallon water volume, and there are over 100 shrimp in there. I spotted new babies again. The like wood, I guess... Once they start, the trick is not to overfeed. You'd be amazed at how easily they find food in the tank. 

Love OG! 😍

[Jawjagrrl]

On 12/12/2021 at 12:17 PM, eatyourpeas said:

Just caught up with this journal. The tank looks great!

I have a 6 gal. heavily occupied tank with lots of wood for my Vampire crabs. The water level is less than half way, so I am assuming less than 3 gallons minus all the displaced water by the wood. I'd say it is a 2 gallon water volume, and there are over 100 shrimp in there. I spotted new babies again. The like wood, I guess... Once they start, the trick is not to overfeed. You'd be amazed at how easily they find food in the tank. 

Love OG! 😍

Thanks! I'm quite pleased with this little box of water. I think about your vampire crab tank often 😄 I saw shrimp in the cholla wood the other day, but they've really taken to the frogbit or whatever this floating plant is. Ready with some fry food if need be when shrimplets arrive - hope the scuds/endlers don't eat too many of them. Given the mix of colors of shrimp, I'll be really curious as to what I get this 1st generation - I seem to have males/females of all colors but the green (M) and snowball (F). OG has a special place in my aquarists' heart for her journey through bettas, ph shock, losing eggs, etc. Extra curious to see her babies given the possible males - green, blue, red, orange or yellow.

[Jawjagrrl]

Well..... I *think* I have shrimplets, though I haven't been able to see any. Mama shrimp has spent the last3 days mostly behind the filter in a quiet spot and looks decidedly thinner this morning. 

How big are new shrimplets? I have scuds, but I don't see them eating them all overnight? I do have lots of floating plants and a couple magnolia leaves resting against the back that they could hide behind. Lots of other places too. Just dying to see one!