Testing bottled water today??s

[Atitagain]

I’m gonna be testing bottled water today in order to lower my ph from a solid 8.1 need to get it down to about 6.5, my questions are;

1) is this really a viable option? Have plenty of it so no worries on that (I know it’s expensive but it’s only short term for a breeding project)

2)what ratio should I start with? Was thinking 50%

3)will be using catappa leaves during breeding but not in testing, how many and how much do these lower ph in a 20G scenario?

all my tanks run very similar except planted tanks ph runs a little lower maybe 7.6 at lowest. This test strip is from a tank that’s as close to set up as I will have during project. Am I reading correctly?

hardness= off the scale +300

buffer=probably mid 200s

ph=8.1

p.s. Patriotic Murphy says hello everyone!

[GameCzar]

I haven't used the leaves, so I can't speak to that.

As for your bottled waters, I believe @Guppysnail has done some testing.    For lowering PH, Distilled sits at a solid 7.0, so it might be your best bet to get that number down.

[GameCzar]

On 9/2/2021 at 7:35 AM, Nooby said:

@GameCzar why Indian almond leaves are great!

I just haven't needed them, no particular reason.  My only tank that needed to be lower PH has been my 3gallon cube, and with fluval stratum and distilled water it has been stable. 

[Atitagain]

On 9/2/2021 at 8:35 AM, Nooby said:

@Atitagain they lower your ph yes but not super significantly so unless you have very sensitive fish you should be fine

Yes sensitive…rummynose tetra everything I’ve seen 6.5 is about the highest they will breed at

[lefty o]

how does the bottled water itself test out. you never know what inside them bottles has had done to it.  bottle in your picture says has minerals added. how was it filtered, what was the source? test then make a plan. 

[Guppysnail]

Not sure how this will apply to you but wanted to share..a few months ago I made a quest out of finding the perfect ph bottle spring water…long story…it was 7.2-7.4 at opening as soon as it was aerated it jumped to 8.2. This is my aftermath I’m stuck with. You may want to go the distilled route. As @lefty osaid. Added stuf acts funny

[StevesFishTanks]

I have read a few breeding reports from @Fish Folk where they used bottled water in specimen containers. Maybe able to provide some input on different brands.

[Fish Folk]

On 9/2/2021 at 10:24 PM, s1_ said:

I have read a few breeding reports from @Fish Folk where they used bottled water in specimen containers. Maybe able to provide some input on different brands.

I don't use Spring water. Just the R.O. Source WalMart / Great Value water. On the label, it should indicate "from R.O. Source"

[Atitagain]

Straight out of bottle  

aerating now for 24 hours will retest. I plan on having set up for a bit before moving forward 

[Atitagain]

On 9/2/2021 at 10:53 PM, Fish Folk said:

I don't use Spring water. Just the R.O. Source WalMart / Great Value water. On the label, it should indicate "from R.O. Source"

Are you advising this water would be problematic? Should I do more research and start with something else?

[Fish Folk]

On 9/2/2021 at 10:58 PM, Atitagain said:

Are you advising this water would be problematic? Should I do more research and start with something else?

I’d stick with R. O. sourced water for raising fry. Spring water might be problematic, given minerals, additives, etc. 

[Atitagain]

On 9/3/2021 at 2:44 AM, Fish Folk said:

I’d stick with R. O. sourced water for raising fry. Spring water might be problematic, given minerals, additives, etc. 

Ugggg thanks for the advice @Fish Folkbut problem is tho $$$. Looked up even countertop RO systems are over $100 and each bottle of RO water is about $1 and would need at least 20+ to find right balance and do water changes during project. Have a very tight budget for this project and it’s all going towards other needs. I already have 60+ gallons of this water basically at my disposal. So for now will experiment and try with what I have, if it doesn’t work out all I’m really wasting is time.

[Fish Folk]

On 9/3/2021 at 6:06 AM, Atitagain said:

Ugggg thanks for the advice @Fish Folkbut problem is tho $$$. Looked up even countertop RO systems are over $100 and each bottle of RO water is about $1 and would need at least 20+ to find right balance and do water changes during project. Have a very tight budget for this project and it’s all going towards other needs. I already have 60+ gallons of this water basically at my disposal. So for now will experiment and try with what I have, if it doesn’t work out all I’m really wasting is time.

I’ve just jumped in here mid thread. I only use WalMart drinking water sources from R.O. for small fry containers. What are you trying to do? I’m on the road… can’t read much today. Quick summary? 

[Atitagain]

On 9/3/2021 at 6:38 AM, Fish Folk said:

I’ve just jumped in here mid thread. I only use WalMart drinking water sources from R.O. for small fry containers. What are you trying to do? I’m on the road… can’t read much today. Quick summary? 

Setting up a rummynose tetra breeding tank. My water is PH 8.1 need to get to 6.4ish

[Gator]

You can go to your local Wally World to buy 5g jugs of water that is RO/DI water that has a pH of 6.0 for $13, the best part is that you can refill these jugs at Wally World for 39 cents a gallon, or $1.95 for 5g, a whole lot cheaper than a case of bottled water. The last process for this RO/DI water is that it goes through UV sterilization before the water goes into your jug, very, very good.

While the initial cost may sound expensive, consider how much a case of bottled water costs for the amount your buying (24, 12 ounce bottles=288 ounces) versus 128 ounces X 5g=640 ounces + you get UV sterilization with no additives, you'll be saving money exponentially in the long run and you don't have to fork out a lot of money for your own personal RO/DI system.

Buying 1g jugs of Spring water, Distilled water, or Drinking water is also more expensive than these 5g jugs in the long run.

To transfer the water into 1g jugs so that it's easier to handle for water changes, I use a 6 feet section of clear, 3/8th inch inside diameter aquarium hose like you'll find on a gravel vacuum I bought at a hardware store, and I'm sure any hardware store would have the same. Because I use this same hose to transfer water into 1g jugs for my own use such as making tea or cooking, this hose is never used for draining water out of any of my tanks and is kept coiled up in a sealed 1g freezer bag, but kept out of the freezer between uses.

I have a 29g tank and this RO/DI water is 100% of the water in this tank. In this tank I have 5 Bronze Cories, 3 of which I've had for at least 10 years and 2 that were born in this tank, I have 4 Yoyo Loaches that I've had for about a year and they have grown from 1 inch to 4 inches in half that time, 6 Oto's, and 2 Bavarian Rams.

I have a Marineland C220 canister filter for this tank with filter foam in all 4 media baskets, but in the uppermost basket I also  have a small media bag with 1 tablespoon of Fluval Peat Pellets in it to make this tank a blackwater tank, and above that I have a fine polishing filter pad. I used to use Oak leaves to create a blackwater environment and they work very well and some European aquarists still swear by them, but Oak leaves can't be found in all parts of the US.

You should be able to breed any blackwater fish in this set-up, including Tetra's.

Sincerely

Gator

[Fish Folk]

On 9/3/2021 at 6:45 AM, Atitagain said:

Setting up a rummynose tetra breeding tank. My water is PH 8.1 need to get to 6.4ish

I’d use rainwater / groundwater.

[Gator]

Raindrops cleanse chemicals out of the air on their way to the ground / groundwater probably has a lot of Calcium Carbonate in it possibly causing it's pH to be 8.1. 

[Atitagain]

On 9/3/2021 at 6:50 AM, Gator said:

You can go to your local Wally World to buy 5g jugs of water that is RO/DI water that has a pH of 6.0 for $13, the best part is that you can refill these jugs at Wally World for 39 cents a gallon, or $1.95 for 5g, a whole lot cheaper than a case of bottled water. The last process for this RO/DI water is that it goes through UV sterilization before the water goes into your jug, very, very good.

While the initial cost may sound expensive, consider how much a case of bottled water costs for the amount your buying (24, 12 ounce bottles=288 ounces) versus 128 ounces X 5g=640 ounces + you get UV sterilization with no additives, you'll be saving money exponentially in the long run and you don't have to fork out a lot of money for your own personal RO/DI system.

Buying 1g jugs of Spring water, Distilled water, or Drinking water is also more expensive than these 5g jugs in the long run.

To transfer the water into 1g jugs so that it's easier to handle for water changes, I use a 6 feet section of clear, 3/8th inch inside diameter aquarium hose like you'll find on a gravel vacuum I bought at a hardware store, and I'm sure any hardware store would have the same. Because I use this same hose to transfer water into 1g jugs for my own use such as making tea or cooking, this hose is never used for draining water out of any of my tanks and is kept coiled up in a sealed 1g freezer bag, but kept out of the freezer between uses.

I have a 29g tank and this RO/DI water is 100% of the water in this tank. In this tank I have 5 Bronze Cories, 3 of which I've had for at least 10 years and 2 that were born in this tank, I have 4 Yoyo Loaches that I've had for about a year and they have grown from 1 inch to 4 inches in half that time, 6 Oto's, and 2 Bavarian Rams.

I have a Marineland C220 canister filter for this tank with filter foam in all 4 media baskets, but in the uppermost basket I also  have a small media bag with 1 tablespoon of Fluval Peat Pellets in it to make this tank a blackwater tank, and above that I have a fine polishing filter pad. I used to use Oak leaves to create a blackwater environment and they work very well and some European aquarists still swear by them, but Oak leaves can't be found in all parts of the US.

You should be able to breed any blackwater fish in this set-up, including Tetra's.

Sincerely

Gator

Do you have to add minerals back into this water to get a decent buffer and if so what? I would imagine I’d use my tap water in a concentration to bring up the buffer but try to keep the PH as close as I can to what I need?

[Gator]

No, no buffers. 

[Guppysnail]

have you thought about using substrate such as fluval stratum and things like peat moss to lower ph?

[ARMYVET]

On 9/2/2021 at 9:02 PM, Guppysnail said:

Not sure how this will apply to you but wanted to share..a few months ago I made a quest out of finding the perfect ph bottle spring water…long story…it was 7.2-7.4 at opening as soon as it was aerated it jumped to 8.2. This is my aftermath I’m stuck with. You may want to go the distilled route. As @lefty osaid. Added stuf acts funny

I could use some of those paper towels and the coke!😏

[Atitagain]

On 9/3/2021 at 7:11 AM, Guppysnail said:

have you thought about using substrate such as fluval stratum and things like peat moss to lower ph?

Yes but this is a temporary set up only for breeding then let the PH slowly move back up as the fry grow out. And those options seem to me, to have in relative terms small affect when needing to move from 8.1 to 6.4

i sill have plenty of research to do and this may be an option to seriously consider.

[Gator]

It doesn't matter if I'm breeding or not, if my blackwater fish such as my Neon Tetra's are happiest and most likely to breed at a pH of 6.0, I'll keep their pH at 6.0 or as close to it as possible, but you may have other ideas and that's OK.

[Fish Folk]

On 9/3/2021 at 6:58 AM, Gator said:

Raindrops cleanse chemicals out of the air on their way to the ground / groundwater probably has a lot of Calcium Carbonate in it possibly causing it's pH to be 8.1. 

This depends on how and when groundwater is collected. I collect from my sump after rain or in spring. pH is 7.0, KH is 1 drop. I agree that the best plan is tons of tannins. Scott Fellman has great info on using tannins. I use Rooibos Tea bags to tweak tannins to desired levels. Catappa leaves and Alder cones are also standard for me. Mopani wood will leech loads of tannins when first used too.

But from a breeding standpoint… I’m not sure pH is always the essential metric to chase. I’d sooner aim for low hardness than low pH.