apisto super red breeding

[the other Irene]

thought I'd try apisto breeding- then I got the 1st batch and now the 2nd batch.  I maybe soon over run. oops

Edited August 12, 2021 by the other Irene

[Colu]

Congratulations on your breeding success

[the other Irene]

thanks- may need to separate the pair- going to run out of space

 

[Patrick_G]

Those fry are pretty darn cute! Congrats.

[Nik_n]

Could I ask how you bred them? I was considering getting a trio and trying to breed them myself. 

[tolstoy21]

Breeding these is pretty easy in my experience. 

Put a male and female in a tank with an Apisto cave, a nice amount of plants and driftwood and some Indian Almond leaves. The water should be on the softer side, but I believe others have bred them in hard water. Water temps in the upper 70s. Rotate some frozen foods into the weekly feeding and add a small amount of baby brine or vinegar eels each day so the parents know there is live food available.

Or, sometimes you don't need to do anything and they just breed anyway. 

Things to know: The female can get quite nasty once the fry are free swimming, even to her own mate. And, sometimes, you put a pair together and they decide to never start a family for their own personal reasons they haven't yet shared with me.  😉

Good luck on any future breeding attempts!

Edited August 12, 2021 by tolstoy21

[the other Irene]

I Just got a pair- put them in a 12 gallon bare bottom take w/ an apisto cave and a coconut hut- some plants and an almond leaf.  I have very soft water and they just bred twice so far.  I got them in May 2021.  

[the other Irene]

what amazes me is the rate they grow.  The babies with mom fish are the 1st day I found them so can only be a few days old. the bigger fry are only 3 wks old in the picture.

[Hobbit]

Congrats! The fry look great!

[Crabby]

On 8/12/2021 at 8:57 PM, Nik_n said:

Could I ask how you bred them? I was considering getting a trio and trying to breed them myself. 

I would recommend a pair for this variety.

[Nik_n]

I would probably add them to my planted community tank (50gallon). Would love to see get them to breed, but would definitely pull the eggs out afterwords. 

[Crabby]

@Nik_n Why pull the eggs? It’s so much of a hassle. I prefer to let natural selection complete its course. You’ll still get a bunch of fry, and you get to watch the amazing parental behaviours too!

I’ve successfully spawned apistos countless times in a community tank by using this method:

Feed loads of frozen foods. Have some dry stuff too, but mostly frozen and live if you can. Also feed some tiny foods like microworms, vinegar eels, BBS or hikari first bites so they know the fry will have a good food source.

Drop the pH below 6.5. I’ve had best success at 5.5 or 6, but at least get it down to 6.5 using driftwood and almond leaves. Use a couple caves, and obviously lots of plants, but you said your tank is already planted.

Temperature should be in the high 70s to very low 80s, but it’s okay if it’s mid-70s.

Then just sit back and watch the magic, and if you feed BBS, get them ready.

Edited August 16, 2021 by Crabby

[the other Irene]

Once this new batch gets to about 1 month and I pull them I plan to put a tank divider in so I can stop the breeding for awhile.  Female needs a rest and male needs to not be beaten up for awhile

[Crabby]

Wow, your female beats up your male? What’s their size difference? My female is definitely more active during their spawning, but my male is probably twice her size. Or I guess it could be because you’re doing it in a 12 gallon. That would make a lot of sense too.

 

Edited August 14, 2021 by Crabby

[the other Irene]

my female is about a 1/3 of his size. she will go and slap him in his face with her tail.. I have never seen him even try to eat  fry.. I just got a tank divider to install today.

[the other Irene]

when there are no fry around they get along fine

[Crabby]

Haha that’s like what my female does when she’s trying to show off for my male and he won’t pay attention. She flares and dances, and then if he isn’t looking after a while, she just goes up right in his face and waves her tail in front of his nose.

[Nik_n]

On 8/14/2021 at 12:13 AM, Crabby said:

@Nik_n Why pull the eggs? It’s so much of a hassle. I prefer to let natural selection complete its course. You’ll still get a bunch of fry, and you get to watch the amazing parental behaviours too!

I’ve successfully spawned apistos countless times in a community tank by using this method:

Feed loads of frozen foods. Have some dry stuff too, but mostly frozen and live if you can. Also feed some tiny foods like microworms, vinegar eels, BBS or hikari first bites so they know the fry will have a good food source.

Drop the pH below 6.5. I’ve had best success at 5.5 or 6, but at least get it down to 6.5 using driftwood and almond leaves. Use a couple caves, and obviously lots of plants, but you said your tank is already planted.

Temperature should be in the high 70s to very low 80s, but it’s okay if it’s mid-70s.

Then just sit back and watch the magic, and if you feed BBS, get them ready.

I thought that the fry would get eaten in a community tank, with two angelfish and a blue gourami. However if its possible to get the fry to survive I would love to try the natural approach. 

I'm not sure if I can get my pH to be that low. The ph of my water is 7.6. I have driftwood but I could always add more and almond leaves. Would the lower ph affect the gourami?

I keep my tank at 80°C. 

I will go to the fish store tomorrow and decide on which pair I would get. How big do they need to be in order to be a ready to breed?

Thanks 

 

Edited August 17, 2021 by Nik_n

[Crabby]

On 8/16/2021 at 11:59 PM, Nik_n said:

I thought that the fry would get eaten in a community gallon, with two angelfish and a blue gourami. However if its possible to get the fry to survive I would love to try the natural approach. 

I'm not sure if I can get my pH to be that low. The ph of my water is 7.6. I have driftwood but I could always add more and almond leaves. Would the lower ph affect the gourami?

I keep my tank at 80°C. 

I will go to the fish store tomorrow and decide on which pair I would get. How big do they need to be in order to be a ready to breed?

Thanks 

 

Hmm I’m not sure if you could trust the angelfish. But the gourami would be fine. The parenting instincts in apistogrammas (as described by Irene’s experiences) are very strong, and for such a small fish, a female Apistogramma sure knows how to keep her babies safe. If the angelfish are fully grown I probably wouldn’t risk it, but if they’re still young then I think you could try.

I’ve heard of people breeding some types of apistos in neutral water, even in stuff a bit over neutral, but that probably means you can’t do some of the less common or more exotic types. 
I think lower pH should be fine for the gourami. If it’s a slow transition, most fish handle it really well.

In terms of size, I’m not sure what size they can breed at. I never measured mine, and they’ve grown a bit since they first spawned. @the other Irene has a younger pair I think, she would be able to give you a more accurate measurement.

[Hobbit]

@Fish Folk has bred a lot of fish and may have some perspective to share!

[Fish Folk]

On 8/16/2021 at 10:45 PM, Hobbit said:

@Fish Folk has bred a lot of fish and may have some perspective to share!

Enjoyed reading this thread! Congrats on the Apisto fry. Honestly, we've had poor success with Apistos. We had one nice Cacatuoides Super Red pair spawn a few times, but no fry. Another A. Bitaeniata spawned, but the few fry that hatched were picked off by Neon Tetras in the tank. I've definitely witnessed the females tail-whip the males. It's a hoot! I get popcorn, and pull up a stool to the octagon to watch the girl's smack the boys around. I'm not persuaded pH is as big of a deal as is GH / KH. Water needs to be soft. Out tap water is soft, but moderately high pH. My son -- the "original Fish Folk" -- wants Cactuoides Super Reds again for his 75 gal. Once I sell off my Killifish colony, I'll probably try breeding Apistos in my 33 gal long. It's begging to be an Apisto tank . . .

[Nik_n]

On 8/17/2021 at 12:15 AM, Crabby said:

Hmm I’m not sure if you could trust the angelfish. But the gourami would be fine. The parenting instincts in apistogrammas (as described by Irene’s experiences) are very strong, and for such a small fish, a female Apistogramma sure knows how to keep her babies safe. If the angelfish are fully grown I probably wouldn’t risk it, but if they’re still young then I think you could try.

I’ve heard of people breeding some types of apistos in neutral water, even in stuff a bit over neutral, but that probably means you can’t do some of the less common or more exotic types. 
I think lower pH should be fine for the gourami. If it’s a slow transition, most fish handle it really well.

In terms of size, I’m not sure what size they can breed at. I never measured mine, and they’ve grown a bit since they first spawned. @the other Irene has a younger pair I think, she would be able to give you a more accurate measurement.

The angelfish are fully grown, that was one of my biggest worries. It would be complicated during feeding times. I wanted to ask if I could keep apistos with corydoras or bristlenose catfish? 

I wouldn't be breeding or keeping any exotic types in this tank, maybe sometimes in the future. 

About the size: the ones in my LFS are usually pretty small so thats why I wanted to make sure. Also, at what age do they start breeding? 

[the other Irene]

my female is pretty small 1-1.5 inches. Male is 2.5-3 inches.  I got them from the fish store in beginning of May and the 1st batch I found July 13.

[Crabby]

On 8/17/2021 at 9:26 PM, Nik_n said:

The angelfish are fully grown, that was one of my biggest worries. It would be complicated during feeding times. I wanted to ask if I could keep apistos with corydoras or bristlenose catfish? 

I wouldn't be breeding or keeping any exotic types in this tank, maybe sometimes in the future. 

About the size: the ones in my LFS are usually pretty small so thats why I wanted to make sure. Also, at what age do they start breeding? 

So you can definitely keep them with bristlenose cats. I’ve bred my BNs with the apistos in the tank, and the apistos with the BNs in the tank. No problems there. I think cories should be fine as well, but I haven’t tried it. I’d definitely give it a go if I had space.

I think Fish Folk is probably right about the softness thing. I always attribute the spawning to my pH because it seems so extreme, but my water is super soft too.

I wish I could say that apistos become sexually mature at X age, but I’m not quite sure I can. My oldest juvies are now a year and a half old, and I think there’s a chance they could breed if I moved them into a different tank, but I’m not sure. They’ve grown quite slowly due to the amount of fry they had to compete with, and they’re only just speeding up that process now that I’ve sold the rest. Whereas some people will grow out their fry in a crystal clean environment with baby brine 3 times a day, and they could be sexually mature by 9 months. I’d say a year on average would be about the age of maturity, though. Sorry if that isn’t very helpful.

[Nik_n]

 

On 8/18/2021 at 12:06 AM, Crabby said:

So you can definitely keep them with bristlenose cats. I’ve bred my BNs with the apistos in the tank, and the apistos with the BNs in the tank. No problems there. I think cories should be fine as well, but I haven’t tried it. I’d definitely give it a go if I had space.

I think Fish Folk is probably right about the softness thing. I always attribute the spawning to my pH because it seems so extreme, but my water is super soft too.

I wish I could say that apistos become sexually mature at X age, but I’m not quite sure I can. My oldest juvies are now a year and a half old, and I think there’s a chance they could breed if I moved them into a different tank, but I’m not sure. They’ve grown quite slowly due to the amount of fry they had to compete with, and they’re only just speeding up that process now that I’ve sold the rest. Whereas some people will grow out their fry in a crystal clean environment with baby brine 3 times a day, and they could be sexually mature by 9 months. I’d say a year on average would be about the age of maturity, though. Sorry if that isn’t very helpful.

Thanks a lot. How long did you grow the fry out until you sold them? I went to my local fish store yesterday and asked about the apistos. They said they are getting a new shipment in on Friday, but they don't know how big the fish will be. Dose anyone know how old are the fish when they first get in. I would probably need to grow the fish out for 6 months before mature, but thats fine too. 

The ph of my water is high but the water is very soft, so I don't think the gh and kh would be a problem.