Colu Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 At this rate Your going to end up with full rack of tanks just for your puffers 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted September 18, 2021 Author Share Posted September 18, 2021 @Colu we have the option at least. Only true fry in the primary overflow sump rack system at the moment, are 7 pelvicachromis subocellatus moanda "krib" fry 2 months old and a couple of 1st month limia Perugia. Fry growout size is that smallest polycarbonate tank in the 2nd level left/warm water side. Rest are grow outs or breeding projects. On 9/18/2021 at 11:09 AM, Patrick_G said: How are those Melkong fry doing? I got a first batch learning experience around day 35 .... put them in a grow out but I think the stress of moving caused them to stop eating. That and a slight change in temperature preceeded the remaining fry dying over that week. Great lessons learned though. Next round of fry if they occur will build off of that experience. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted September 18, 2021 Share Posted September 18, 2021 On 9/18/2021 at 4:13 PM, mountaintoppufferkeeper said: got a first batch learning experience around day 35 .... put them in a grow out but I think the stress of moving caused them to stop eating. That and a slight change in temperature preceeded the remaining fry dying over that week. Great lessons learned though. Next round of fry if they occur will build off of that experience. sorry, I had feeling something happened when you stopped posting photos. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted September 19, 2021 Author Share Posted September 19, 2021 @Patrick_G thanks no worries I learned a lot from that batch and improved the skill set a bit for puffer fry. In brighter news hydei fruit flies are a hit with the butterflyfish 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 11, 2021 Author Share Posted October 11, 2021 Pao palustris spawn 3 in the cave. Letting nature take its course on this one and will just move the fry to the breeder boxes once free swimming and visable +/- 3 days from hatching. Spawn 1 : 1 week of heavy courtship abruptly ended by a female body being ejected from the males cave 30 seconds after entering for the last time. (Wyze "Puffer cam" motion capture and playback feature was valuable for figuring this out. No visible damage to body of female which was removed nearly immediately. Fertile eggs fry visible hunting even at small size 14 days later Spawn 2: 6 days of heavy courtship eggs pulled after 2 days once seen -- female did not die and eggs were not fertilized. Spawn 3: 1 week of heavy courtship. At some point that female died and was discovered directly above the entrance to the male's cave. Almost certainly the same process as the first death based on location and lack of visible damage to female. It does seem like whatever happens at the end of spawning the death of the female may be required for viable eggs. I almost view it as a requirement to get the male to fertilize and protect the spawn based off of spawn 2. I am convinced it is not a result of the male doing anything to the female since when documented it happened very quickly and there was no damage to the female. They are built to argue and have plenty of feisty interactions when not breeding and not feeding as a colony. The only deaths are post successful spawning. Anyone heard of this before with other species ? I thought it worth sharing; it is a very interesting pattern developing. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted October 11, 2021 Share Posted October 11, 2021 Wow, so interesting. I feel like there's plenty of insects that reproduction requires death, didn't realize fish could be that way too. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 12, 2021 Author Share Posted October 12, 2021 On 10/11/2021 at 3:29 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: Wow, so interesting. I feel like there's plenty of insects that reproduction requires death, didn't realize fish could be that way too. It does not seem to be caused directly by the male. The speed of death when it occurs and lack of visible damage to the female almost completely rules him out in my opinion. I would expect to see aggression or at least a little damage if it were the male causing it. No split fins no scratches, nothing visible make me think the female death is possibly a result of spawning at my altitude, in my water, as a colony, etc;or how and what I feed;or the age of the WC adult puffers involved, or somehow that possibly that being a survival strategy of the species. That seems odd but I bought my group online unsexed and it broke down to 1 male and 5 female. They crank out eggs and fry it is every 60 days or so for my group. This is not something I've experienced with any other species before. It has peaked my curiosity enough that I wanted to share and see of anyone may have some insight based off of their experiences with other species. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted October 12, 2021 Share Posted October 12, 2021 Even MORE fascinating! Wondering if mom releases some sort of chemical to finish the spawn? I reminds me of a podcast I listened to of a certain species of octopus that once she lays she will absolutely not move from her spot. She literally starves to death even when food is offered to sit with her eggs. Other than protection there has got to be more to that. Like with certain insects and parents sacrificing themselves for food. Obviously the puffer isn't doing this in her death, but I still wonder about a chemical release. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 12, 2021 Author Share Posted October 12, 2021 Very fascinating indeed. I am looking forward to learning more from my colony as it grows. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 17, 2021 Author Share Posted October 17, 2021 (edited) Apologies for the out of focus Pao palustris spawn #4 eggs. Seems promising to this point. Male is out of frame within his clay cave in spawning and spawn defense reversed colors dark green with light green spots. Edited October 17, 2021 by mountaintoppufferkeeper 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ken Burke Posted October 17, 2021 Share Posted October 17, 2021 So kewl! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 24, 2021 Author Share Posted October 24, 2021 Pulled a few more from the cave palustris male still guarding to the point that he attacked the airline used to remove eggs today. The level of aggression made me think hatching was within 24 hours. 2 hours later approximately 20 of 30 pulled have hatched out. 3 palustris as they hatched out today 24 October 2021. That shooting up is a result of breaking through. Very cool to witness that happen. A first for me. Just after hatching those green bits are duckweed on the outside of the coop specimen and puffer hatching container The first swim A better view of a first swim male top left remaining spawn center on slate. Male guarding the remainder 4 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick_G Posted October 24, 2021 Share Posted October 24, 2021 Awesome! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 That footage is incredible! Thanks for sharing!!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd Duck Posted October 25, 2021 Share Posted October 25, 2021 ORD, but very cool! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 26, 2021 Author Share Posted October 26, 2021 Day 2 Starting to swim a bit added some vinegar eels for those who are further along from the egg sac 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 27, 2021 Author Share Posted October 27, 2021 Day 2.5 🙂 not really expected but already have puffers actively hunting vinegar eels. Threw a little polyfilter cube in the coop qontainer to help out with the water quality and removal of the light blue aqntifungal and chasing each other a bit 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 28, 2021 Author Share Posted October 28, 2021 Day 5 overhead of the temporary home of a portion of the Pao palustris fry from this spawn COOP container during a water change and poly filter cube swap. 16 healthy fry in this one 6 in the other container and another 30 or so with dad in the cave. My current plan is to leave that portion of fry with the parents in the 75 gallon and see what happens between the fry, the male, and the females post free swimming fry. Maybe the male guards the fry for a bit maybe he only guards until they leave the "nest. I will update as that experiment progresses as well. I do wonder if these fry will grow at a different rate than those left in with the adults. That was an observation with the dwarf pike spawn of Crenicichla regani in January 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted October 30, 2021 Author Share Posted October 30, 2021 Day 6 Feeding on live brine reaulting in those pink bellys, and vinegar eels 3 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted November 2, 2021 Author Share Posted November 2, 2021 Day 8 Pao palustris fry Moved to their own 20 gallon tank hunting live baby brine 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted November 7, 2021 Author Share Posted November 7, 2021 Day 14 Evening feeding. A bit tough to photograph them due to size vs a 20 gallon planted tank. They tend to use the subwassertang and etc forest for cover. 4 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eatyourpeas Posted November 7, 2021 Share Posted November 7, 2021 They are developing beautifully! Thanks so much for this journal, it is a lot of fun to follow! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted November 8, 2021 Author Share Posted November 8, 2021 Day 16 am feeding 3 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xXInkedPhoenixX Posted November 8, 2021 Share Posted November 8, 2021 What size are they at this point? They are sooo cool!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mountaintoppufferkeeper Posted November 8, 2021 Author Share Posted November 8, 2021 On 11/8/2021 at 12:17 PM, xXInkedPhoenixX said: What size are they at this point? They are sooo cool!! I'd say about the size of a pencil eraser. The food they are eating in the gifs are fresh hatched baby brine shrimp. We are pretty zoomed in with the phone camera for the shots 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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