Advice, Opinions, Suggestions Needed

[NewerFishPerson]

Longwinded .. Sorry 🙂 Wanted to share enough info. ** So I never actually posted this last night as I meant to.  Therefore first part yesterday morning. Today UPDATE BELOW.. 

**Yesterday Morning /Afternoon : Hello. New to the hobby and this forum has been very helpful, Im in  a stuck moment though. We were having issues initially with our tank actually cycling, however it finally started to after adding some other fish.   It seems to be doing its thing, ammonia levels finally broke as nitrite levels went up, and then the nitrates started to build. We have been just  letting the tank do it's thing, and have been doing water changes once weekly and dosing with prime to keep the levels in check and keep the fish as safe as possible. About a week ago I noticed the platy rubbing on the plants, it was only occasionally and after a water test showed higher nitrite readings we did a 30 -40 percent water change and that seemed to help. Over the last couple of days he seems to have gotten much worse. He goes through spouts of darting around the tank, rubs the gravel, rubs the plants and then holds still for a while, then darts forward. Almost appears to be having a seizure at times. Now he just lays around on top of things and barely moves, fins not moving but he's breathing. The molly in tank who has been very active is now acting the same way. Has been wobbling alot as well. They both go through spouts of seeming very agitated and swim erratically around the tank, and rub on the gravel over and over and the plants. Then they will both barely move, but if I remove the lid or drop any food in they both come right to life and eat everything up as if they are fine. I have only been feeding them small amounts every other day to help keep the ammonia and nitrites in check as much as possible through the cycle.   We also have a fake plant that is getting brown algae on it, we attempted to rinse it a bit during the last water change. We rinsed in tank water as to not kill any bacteria on it. 

I have been checking them several times a day to look for white spots and researching parasites. I don't really want to medicate until I know for sure what they may be having an issue with, and don't want to medicate if they are reacting to the higher nitrite levels due to cycling.  Earlier today it seemed the tank had some floating particles in it. I added 1/2 TBSP of aquarium salt in an attempt to do something to make them more comfortable and in case we are dealing with Ick. I know that's not much, but wanted to start small, as I didn't want to cause further irritation to them. The molly just goes vertical by the heater most of the time, have thought she was gone a few times, same with platy cause he wasn't moving. I'll drop a piece of flake into the tank and they both go crazy wanting to eat. Platy had a very long string looking piece of poo hanging on earlier too. Seemed a bit much when I'm not feeding them much. Didn't want to go crazy with the salt either since I've read that plecos can be more sensitive and I have a java fern as well. Have been reducing the lights on as well to help with the stress aspect. 

**Last Night Update: The tank water seems to have cleared dramatically since this afternoon. Before going to work it appeared to have particles floating through it and was hard to even get clear photos. They both seem to be very stressed still and not moving and gills are tucked in. I added another 1/2 tbsp of aquarium salt. Just laying on top of tank decor. 

Today UPDATE THIS MORNING: Water is crystal clear for the first time since starting the tank around 4/6. Turned on the lights and platy and molly came right to the top. They are both swimming around the tank just eating off things, and not laying around at all. They are back to chasing each other every so often. Minimal flashing on anything as well. Pleco was dashing around the tank last few days as well, and pleco is even just moving around normally, and acting normal. 

Fed them just a moment ago and they are very eagerly eating. 

I also this morning ordered two new plants an amazon sword and a scarlet temple and one planter. I want to get rid of the fake plant with the brown looking algae and add these in. Is removing this plant ok even though we are working through a first cycle. Dont want to disturb bacteria buildup too much. But want live plants. 

 

Tank Info..

10 Gallon Top Fin Corner Tank, upgraded:  We are running an Aqua Clear 20 filtration system. Yes we do plan to upgrade to bigger tank in the near future, looking at getting a 39 gallon. Fish are currently on the smaller side. 🙂  A piece of driftwood with attached Java Fern starting to grow on it. Pleco has been loving it, so thanks for that suggestion.  

3 Fish: Albino BN Pleco (think a female) has been in tank since very small. Female Gold Panda Molly. Male Marlboro Mickey Platy. 

While looking at photos.. Java Fern is getting those brown spots on the tips. Should I trim this? It's been in tank for almost 2 weeks now, and roots are growing longer and seem to be on way to attaching to driftwood. I have been adding Seachum Flourish once a week. 

Water Test Results: **Taken last night. Added photos

Ammonia: 0 

Nitrites .50 -1.0 ppm

Nitrates: 10 - 20 ppm

PH: 6.8-7.0 

Temp: 74-76 Degrees

Photos:

Yesterday Afternoon: Hard to take a clear photo:

Vertical Molly: https://photos.app.goo.gl/jXHbUhsb2CBCe4nc8   https://photos.app.goo.gl/yxkUpVM3KnDcRWLN9

Platy: https://photos.app.goo.gl/pyL44fThvDEVUriR7  https://photos.app.goo.gl/PWDfb2mGaL71tbGk7

Last Night After Work:

Vertical Molly: Brown Algae on heater: https://photos.app.goo.gl/jR5LPyUiSRMwcMA4A 

Platy: https://photos.app.goo.gl/QxVgV4Gbjr5fq2dW8

Albino Pleco: https://photos.app.goo.gl/tTHEE1xMC4PCc1648

Test Results Last Night: 

Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates https://photos.app.goo.gl/JgSKtAjEtvWTuvHw5

PH: https://photos.app.goo.gl/afTysdpvKKVEQc6t7

Fish This Morning: 

https://photos.app.goo.gl/PUERebshXsDP3bZMA

https://photos.app.goo.gl/Axbn5DAkGx7yL3gi8

Platy seems to have some browning on his head. not sure:

https://photos.app.goo.gl/6GwpSGCg4Ly6adke8

 

 

 

 

[Patrick_G]

I’m sorry you’re having so much trouble. I looked at the pic of your recent Nitrite test and it sure looks like 5ppm. That’s pretty high. If I were you I’d do a big water change as soon as possible and add the recommended dose of prime each day until you see zero Nitrites. I think your cycle isn’t finished yet. 

[lefty o]

for adding new plants and removing the fake ones. being early on in the tanks life, i would probably add the new plants (live plants do good things for your tank, so for sure a good move), but i would probably leave the fake ones in the tanks for a few days after adding the live ones. the fake plants do have good bacteria growing on them, so leaving them for a short time will allow the new live plants to have good bacteria grow on them.

[Nancy K]

Welcome to the forum and from your post I can tell you are educating yourself and doing all the right things. That’s great and best of luck to you. The only things I can add that may be helpful are water changes are your Best friend right now and I would check your parameters out of the tap water/source water too to better understand what your tank is doing and the parameters of the water going in. 10 gallons with good filtration and careful water keeping like you are doing is still a lot to ask to get and remain stable with a pleco (aka poop machines) but i understand from your post upgrade plans are near term. When you do switch over take your existing substrate with you even if in a filter media sock to help seed the new tank’s beneficial bacteria. Lastly I would be double dosing PRIME until fixed/settled. Good luck!

Edited June 4, 2021 by Nancy K
Wrong info on pH

[Patrick_G]

3 hours ago, Nancy K said:

Welcome to the forum and from your post I can tell you are educating yourself and doing all the right things. That’s great and best of luck to you. The only things I can add that may be helpful are water changes are your Best friend right now and I would check your parameters out of the tap water/source water too to better understand what your tank is doing and the parameters of the water going in. 10 gallons with good filtration and careful water keeping like you are doing is still a lot to ask to get and remain stable with a pleco (aka poop machines) but i understand from your post upgrade plans are near term. When you do switch over take your existing substrate with you even if in a filter media sock to help seed the new tank’s beneficial bacteria. Lastly I would be double dosing PRIME. 
 

 

Edited June 4, 2021 by Patrick_G

[Nancy K]

40 minutes ago, Patrick_G said:

@Nancy K, I might be wrong but I believe a low PH helps mitigate the effects of Ammonia on the fish not the other way around. Forum members, please correct me If I have it backwards! 

I went and looked and you are correct and I had it backwards. Yikes! I will try to edit. Thanks @Patrick_G

https://be.chewy.com/the-role-of-ph-in-the-aquarium-nitrogen-cycle/

 

[quikv6]

A few thoughts:

1) I echo the sentiment of getting the Nitrites down. Small water changes and Prime will work. In a 10 gallon, fluctuation can happen rapidly, as can the rise of Nitrites. Slow and steady and thoughtful wins the race.

2) I can't speak to the plecos, but the Molly and Platy should greatly benefit from salt. A small amount shouldn't harm the plants either. (1 to 1.5 teaspoon per 5 gallons)

3) Check your temperature. I had started off with a top fin kit when I got into the hobby, and the thermometer that was included with the kit was about 3-4 degrees off from 3 other types of thermometers that I had bought. Now 3-4 degrees may not be the end of the world, but if you are on the low side of 74, you may actually be at 70. Don't go off of the display of those dial top fin heaters.

4) *** GH/KH*** - I saw you posted a PH of 6.8-7.0. To be honest, I feel that is on the low side of what mollies and platies ike. It will certainly work, but if your KH is very low...the PH can swing rapidly, and crash. Also GH is loved by livebearers. If your GH is high, I feel a lower PH will work easier than if the GH is also low. They thrive on hard water.

What are your GH and KH readings?

[NewerFishPerson]

I have API 5 in 1 test strips as well. The water in the tank comes from our tap and it's definitely hard water. So when we were first looking into fish, we looked for ones that would do well with harder water conditions. Our PH was a bit iffy in the beginning, we even added a PH balancer at one point. At this point, it generally is fairly steady at the 7.0 range. Just recently it seemed like it might be dropping a bit. I believe this may be from the fact that we had done a couple of water changes with 3/4 tap water and some reverse osmosis water. We were having a bad time getting ammonia to break. We tested the tap water from the faucet and the ammonia was pretty high, along with chlorine and all, so we though that might be the issue. We didn't do that the last water change. We have a couple of gallon jugs that we keep filled to use when doing water changes. We fill them and treat them with prime.  *Edited to add.. the temp we are reading is from a thermometer that we have in the tank as well, not the top fin heater reading. 

*Here is what the test chart looks like for reference:

KH is 0, GH is in the 120 range . PH is 7.0 (Freshwater) Nitrite 5 , Nitrate 40

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-5mu6HjKNGnU/U7mp-qnNWrI/AAAAAAAAAOA/-lkLqj6hhVU/s1600/teststrip.jpg

 

Edited June 5, 2021 by NewerFishPerson

[quikv6]

If KH is 0, that could definitely be causing a PH swing/crash. I would try to get that up (slowly) in order to stabilize your PH. You can add crushed coral to the substrate or filter.

You can also add Seachems Alkaline buffer, or baking soda. If using these 2 methods, absolutely test a small amount in a bucket of water to see what a given amount does as far as change to KH and PH. When KH rises, so will PH. You don't want to shock the fish...so make sure to test first in a bucket of a known volume of water.

[NewerFishPerson]

I have a bottle of API Proper PH 7.0. Would that help? 

These are the PH needs for the fish & plants in the tank 🤨 Molly seems to need the most..  So where is the balance for them all.

Molly: 7.5-8.5

Platy: 6.8-8.0

Bristlenose Pleco 6.5-7.5

Java Fern; 6.0-7.0

Ordered and to be added soon: 

Amazon Sword: 6.5-7.5

Scarlett Temple: 6.0-7.0

Edited June 5, 2021 by NewerFishPerson
update info

[quikv6]

I am one that keeps mollies and platys. Unfortunately, the water is extremely soft with low KH in my area. (KH is about 30-40.)

I do "doctor" my water to match the hardness that the livebearers thrive on. I also bring the KH/PH up with crushed coral, and some baking soda. (I would not go right to the baking soda)

In your case, being you have the hardness, I'd just focus on getting that KH up, and stable. Forget the guides for the fish and plants. You'll be fine in that department. The stability is what is important, and having 0 KH is a PH crash/fluctuation waiting to happen.

I think if you can get your KH up to around 60-80ppm, you should be good. The PH will rise a bit by default, but as long as this is done slowly (i.e: crushed coral), the fish and plants will be fine.

I would avoid the "PH up/proper PH" products altogether.