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New betta not eating


RyanU
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No, dont medicate quite yet. I would do the following...

  1. Turn down the flow, if he is hanging around the same corner constantly, the opposite corner of the filter it sounds like he doesnt like how much flow there is. 
  2. Get Foods like...
    1. Hikari Betta Bio Gold
    2. Fluval Bug Bites
    3. Frozen Blood Worms
  3. And soak those foods in garlic, garlic may attract the fish towards the food
  4. Give him some time to rest. You said you have only had him for a few days, so just relax. He will start feeding soon. Because its only been a few days, and hes a new addition I would just simply wait on any medications.
Edited by James Black
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Ok thank you. I called the pet store i purchaced him from and asked what food they feed and am going to pick that up. I also forgot to purchase an air pump while i was there and temporarily have a line hooked up to the tank from my other tank. he seems to be coming around. he is now tucked under one of the plants next to the filter. I dont think there is to much water flow as the leaves of the small plant barely move. he also has swam under the intake of the filter. It could have possibly been lack of oxygen in the tank. My mistake. What should i do about the fin damage that he had when i purchased him? (See pics from earlier in the thread)

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So one thing to be cautious of is doing too many things at the same time to try to solve multiple problems.  I've had the best luck "doing tai chi" - gradual consistent behavior/treatment gives you great power.  "Doing karate" where you try to fix things in one chop can end up with bigger problems if you've guessed wrong on your course of action or chosen to fight the wrong opponent. 

Getting dude eating is priority- fins can wait.  Meds can kill an appetite and make the water "taste funny" to humans,  so I'm assuming the same goes for fish- if dude is already not inclined to eat,  potentially making things "taste weird" for him complicates fixing that.  Edit- Per @Colu and @James Black Betta's actually seem to like the taste of garlic,  so potentially trying that is "food" and not "bad tasing medicine".

We haven't asked two very basic questions here- 1) What is the PH of the water dude is in?  Betta's can tolerate a pretty good range,  but prefer water more on the acidic and soft side.  Not looking to go changing PH - but this is an important data point. 2) Is dude pooping regularly (or has he pooped at all)?  Are you convinced that he didn't arrive constipated or blocked up? 

There's some very small 1.5 watt air pumps made by Hygger that *I've* found give good aeration while not buffeting a Betta around even in Nano tanks as small as 3 gallons.  They're super quiet as well.  I don't think the chains carry Hygger,  but many independent pet stores as well the giant internet seller from Seattle do.

I always buy from and support independent stores when possible,  but in an emergency situations you can get meds express shipped.  I can literally get Seachem Prime (and pretty much the entire product line of treatments) delivered to my door the same day where I am by using my you know where's Prime account.  Again,  this is my "break the glass" last resort emergency fall back plan- buying my stock of medicine, water products, and food stock to have on hand from a full service store is what I want to do.  

 

Edited by NanoNano
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I agree. Working from Home has its perks. As I can constantly monitor everything. The bad is I can Constantly monitor everything and have a knee jerk reaction. I definitely need to get a pump. I cant believe I forgot that. And some hikari gold betta food. I will just throttle it back with a control valve. I have been constantly rotating the tubes from the betta tank to my other tank as(right or wrong) as I don't want to deprive the other tank of oxygen. and within id say 10 minutes he is back at the top of the tank. when the air is on he goes and hides under one of the plants.

 I just checked my PH and it is between 7.2 and 7.6. Now that you mention it. I haven't seen him poop at all since I brought him home. I just assumed that was from not eating. I think I saw some poo in the cup when I grabbed  him

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Some general off the top of my head comments:

* Bettas take a good amount of their air from the surface,  so aeration in a Betta's tank is *important* but it's primary value isn't helping a Betta respirate from the water column, it's in moving the water column so that the biome can break down the substantial waste Bettas generate and in breaking the tension of the water surface so that Betta's don't have to break through a level of floating protein "scum" to get to atmosphere.

* Building on the point above...There's been mention of "fix" products in this thread.  These often contain oils,  which ultimately separate from the water and end up on the water surface creating a layer of film.  I'm in the "say no to fix" products camp,  but again,  there's more than one way to keep fish.

* I've noticed that several of my Bettas like to hang out near where my filter/heater chamber output is after a water change, or rescaping of their tank.  I've interpreted this as "self soothing" - kind of like humans climbing under a blanket and pulling the covers up over their head when they get a little scared or when they've had a bad day.  Point being that dude is likely not cold- he might have decided that the warmth and vibration of the heater (and maybe some of the electromagnetic field) help make him feel a little more at ease.

* I saw you mention Hikari food on your list.  I'm going to make another plug for Fluval Betta Bug bites as the protein that it includes is insect based (black solider fly larvae...ugh...er yum!).  Nearly every other food uses an aquatic based protein,  so this food does have a major difference from most others.

* I'm not really well versed in dealing with constipated Bettas, so hopefully someone will chime in here.  The two things that I've seen recommended as treatment are live daphnia and peas, so you want to search on both.  I can't wrap my head around peas working.  Bettas are carnivorous.  Some will eat vegetable matter here or there (often just to "hog it" and simply to keep something else in the tank from eating it), but I can't see a Betta that's already not eating well look to eat something that's not on their daily menu.  Hopefully someone with some fish gastroenterology expertise can advise on options here.

* Male bettas are supposed to be the aggressive loners in the fish world,  but I've found that they secretly crave attention and simply seeing someone outside their tank.  I've had a couple that started hiding in plants and generally becoming "mopey" and I've found if I get a cup of coffee and simply pull up a chair or hang out where they can see me (which is different interaction than doing tank maintenance),  it often seems to peak their interest and make them more active.  You might want to try that if that's not already part of the routine - it may take a couple 4 or 5 times for them to warm up to seeing you.

Good luck- keep the faith.  Dude is lucky that someone like you brought him home and are working so hard for him.

 

 

Edited by NanoNano
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I added the air stone last night. I think he spent the entire night up behind the filter. This morning when I turned on thy light to feed  he was swimming a little bit. He ended up tucked under one of the small plants. 

 

One of the big box stores I went to last night don't have either hikari betta good or fluval bug bites so I picked up What betta food they had. He still hasn't eaten withe last night or this morning. I think I'm going to run to thy other big box store on my way home tonight and see if they have either of the foods and also garlic guard.

 

So I guess he is making progress by not sitting at the top of the tank.  Still concerned with the not eating. Hopefully after I grab the other food he will start eating

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Just an update and a question. Tom was swimming around when I got home. I noticed after swimming he would go to the bottom of the tank and open and close his mouth a few times then swim some more. I stopped at the pet store i purchased him from and grabbed the fluval betta bug bites. He still didn't seem interested in eating. I was taking to the guy at the store and he said I could bring him back and they would exchange him and also treat him. 

Should I bring him back and exchange him and let them treat him or keep doing whet I am doing and see if he comes around

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My gut tells me that if the pet store knew the correct treatment for Tom,  they would have simply sold it to you.  I have a feeling that Tom would likely simply be placed back into stock for someone else to purchase if you swapped him for another fish.    You're working super hard on Tom's behalf and trying to get as much expert advice as possible,  I think Tom's best chances to get better and have a great life are clearly with you.

Moving those long fins through the water takes a lot of energy,  so Betta's tend to rest and take a lot of cat naps.  It's likely that what you're seeing is Tom take a minute to rest or take a micro-nap.  This sounds like normal behavior to me.

I hate to be that guy,  but fatherhood prepared be for this- have you been able to determine if he's pooping yet?

Edited by NanoNano
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That's what I think to. I have not seen him poop yet. He also hasn't eaten yet either though. Today I made some mods to the tank and removed the HOB submersible and made a DIY sponge filter which drastically reduced the flow and Tom had been swimming around more. I also put a mirror by his tank to see how he would react. He actually raised his top fin but it didn't fan out. Is it possibly clamped fin? Also his lower funds by his head are very small and they look curled up to me.  

I'm going to continue the treatment of life guard for the recommended schedule and see what happens. 

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While Tom will clearly have a better chance at good health if you keep him, I would consider taking him back.  I know that this is a cold view but he was clearly not completely well when you got him and it's not clear that you will be able to get him better because no one even knows what is wrong with him.  He could have an issue that isn't fixable.  I strongly believe you should take responsibility when you purchase a pet and care for your pet appropriately for their entire lives however this is assuming you are starting with a well pet.  Tom was unwell before you even purchased him.  

If you were my friend/loved one, I would suggest returning him to the pet store and exchanging for a healthy betta.  This does not make you a bad person, it's more a matter of pouring more good time and money after bad... meaning you may not be able to get him into good health but you could be spending that time and money on keeping a well betta healthy.

I hope this doesn't make me sound too jaded, I just don't think it's fair to be saddled with the responsibility of a sick pet when it was sold to you sick.  

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The good thing is I have 30 days to return. I already purchased the meds. I will give the meds the week to see what happens. If nothing is better then I might return. Itrekked to the other fish guy at The other big box store i went to because they have meds in stock said he would do the same thing give it a shot if nothing improves take it back.

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The fact that he's active and interested in things is a good sign.  If he's not listless at this point,  I suspect that his digestive system isn't fully blocked, he just might be a picky eater.  FWIW- I've had Betta's that have found a corner or a place behind a plant or some decor where they consistently poop (like a cat with a litter box), so it may be that he's doing this.  Tom still looks like he's got a good amount of weight on in the pictures that you've posted,  so that's a good sign.  

If the curled fins are his pelvic fins per this chart,  that's a genetic trait.  Undesirable to breeders,  but it has no impact on the mobility or longevity of the fish. It also has no impact on how the other fins on the fish will grow.  I have a Betta with pelvic fins that are curled like corkscrews and he's one of my heartiest fish.  

If you get a rise out of Tom when you show him a mirror,  that's a good sign too.  It's likely that if he was in a cup where he was kept next to other male Bettas in the store he figured out that he couldn't get to them and they couldn't get to him which may account for his "meh" reaction to the mirror.  As he he becomes more comfortable in his new tank and the experiences of his cup fade,  he'll likely become more aggressive in defending his new territory from intruders.

The tank changes you made sound great...and you're quickly gaining expertise in Betta keeping that you're gong to have forever...just unfortunate that it's a bit nerve wracking in doing so.  Again,  Tom is lucky that you chose him and he seems to trying to get well with your help.

Hoping that tomorrow is the day he decides to eat.

 

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Put me in the "keep him and keep trying" camp. You have expended significant effort, care, and concern at this point. It seems like you are making some strides as well. If you return him:

1) I seriously doubt any pet store that has thousands of fish/animals can focus on the care he needs like you can. It's just the law of averages. His best chance is with you, and it sounds like you are motivated to give him the best you can.

2) You'll never know if you could have brought him back to health. Even if you keep him and it doesn't have the best ending, at least you can have solace knowing you did everything you could, instead of wondering if you could've.

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Thanks for that. 

Just to update everyone who has been helping me. 

Last night I added the second Dose of Lifeguard and some aquarium salt at 1 tablespoon for 2 gallons, dosage suggested by @Colu and he is doing much better. Not sure if it is the meds or the Salt but last night my wife checked on him and she said all his fins were open and he was sitting in the middle of the tank. This morning when I turned on the light we was swimming around. Just now he is sitting in front of the Mirror with all this fins open. He still didn't eat anything this morning. I tried giving him a couple baby brine shrimp. He saw them and swam towards them but didn't want to eat. I may run to my LFS tonight and see if I can get some live Baby Brine in hopes that I can peak his interest with a moving target. Then maybe the frozen will be good enough for him after that

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