ramsfan

I think I'd like to give EI a try. The Nilocg website has starter doses for EI and breaks them down to 20-40 gallons and 40-60 gallons. I have a 50 gal tank but around 40 gallons of water??? With my plant mass, would still going with the 40-60 gallon regimen be a good first start? Looking at increasing my plant mass as soon as I can, but just didn't know where to start. Also a few more questions: 1. Would you still dose the 3/4 tsp Epsom salt as I have before (since I won't be using any GH booster and I've seen decent results from having added it over the last month)? Or did my Ca/Mg testing results suffice for Mg ppm levels? 2. Any other suggestions from what the Nilocg website says to start? 3. It looks like the iron in CSM+B is EDTA Fe. Will I still have the same problem with iron as I'm having right now (adding it when pH may still be too high for best plant availability)? Possibly need to supplement anyway with a more available iron (ferrous gluconate)?? Sorry for the continued questions! Thanks for everyone's quick response.

That's interesting that you had more algae problems with using the EI method. Usually touted as a method that does not induce algae as much. I feel like with the tank I have now and want to have in the near future, I'm just chasing nutrient deficiencies. That's why I was thinking that EI is possibly the next step for me. @Seattle_Aquarist what kind of algae problems did you have using the EI method? We're you able to tinker with the nutrients here and there to keep it at bay, or was it just out of control? Just want to know more of what I'm getting into before jumping in. I know from your last post that you have more of a light EI plus root tab regimen now, but just didn't know the sequence of events that led you to your current dosing regimen. The idea of dosing more iron could definitely be a fix. Again, I'm dosing Easy Green probably when pH is around 6.8-7 (which is when the lights have been on for about an hour). That's usually the time I'm available to dose the tank. The pH dips down to 6.6 later on in the afternoon, but I'm not usually there. Thus I probably don't have as much available iron for plants. So looking at iron is definitely a good idea. Thank you again for your responses and help!! You tank looks great!! That is exactly something that I'm striving for here.

Hadn't measured NO3 before a water change in the last 2 weeks, however my Easy Green dose has stayed the same (4 pumps daily). Prior to 2 weeks ago, NO3 had been around 20-30 before water changes. Again, I think I've had some progress. The Mg was a great idea, but growth in my tank has not been robust and where I'd like it. Contemplating going EI method. Any thoughts? If so, I've read up a lot on this (interested in Nilocg dry ferts / mixing my own), but still might need a recommendation on where to start with dosing, etc. Also, if going EI method, do I keep lights the same for a certain amount of time, then increase intensity once I get better growth? Just might need a little help with this transition IF this is the best course of action. Thank you again @Seattle_Aquarist!!

@JoeQ I really liked the Ca/Mg test. Good recommendation. Again, not sure how accurate it is, but I think I used it in a way that gives me an idea on where I'm at with those 2 levels. Also, like your idea about moving a couple stems to different places to see if I get different growth. @Seattle_AquaristWhat do you think about my current pics/updates and also on my possible next steps? Thanks all!!

Hey all. I know it hasn't been quite a month, but it's pretty close. Wanted to give an update on the results from adding Epsom salt weekly for the last 4 weekly water changes. I'll put pics below. I ended up taking out the val grass since there was no growth and was getting too much BBA on it. Also like to spot treat with Excel so figured at some point, I'd kill it off. I bought that Ca/Mg test kit you mentioned @JoeQ. Here are the results from that testing: Tank - Ca 40 ppm, Mg 48.6 ppm Tap water - Ca 80 ppm, Mg 24.3 ppm (obviously before adding epsom salt) Distilled water as a control (I use this for tank top offs once weekly) - Ca 0, Mg 0 So it seems like I have decent Ca and Mg levels now in my tank. I've positioned my wavemaker as best I can to have good flow throughout the tank. In fact, it's pushing my myrio far enough that it grows a decent amount of BBA at the base. Any ideas on how to better place my wavemaker with my tank setup to really get good flow down low? Some of my monte carlo sways, but some is so low that it really can't sway. I've been adding Easy Green when the pH is 6.8 to 7. Still not sure this is good enough to get good usable iron in the tank for the plants. Also starting to get a little bit more BBA as the month has gone on. As for each plant: Pogostemon octopus - growing a lot better Super red - not growing much at all. Gave it a big trim a couple weeks ago to get rid of the lower half algae, and it's not doing much Myrio mattogrossense - growing great (grew great even before Epsom salt) Ozelet sword - not doing that well. You'll see in the pics I've lost some leaves and some current ones are yellowing Buce - growing nicely with larger new leaves Crypts - growing OK -AR mini - gave it a trim and new leaves growing all right. Still kind of fizzles out after a couple weeks. Pics look better than a month ago though -Monte carlo - perked up a bit. Getting OK slow new growth. Overall, some improvement in a few plants. Just not getting much of any robust growth. Any further thoughts are welcome. But here's my take at this point: 1. I believe that I may have just grown out of Easy Green. Here's what I calculated as my weekly fertilizer ppm using my current dose of Easy Green (NO3 21 ppm, PO4 1.1 ppm, K 14 ppm, Fe 0.24 ppm, Mg 1.26 ppm). Need something stronger possibly since I'd like more robust growth and more plant mass in my tank. I've really looked into the EI method over the last few weeks. May be the plan for me but I want you all to see if this could be my next step first. 2. CO2 is pretty much maxed out. I don't see a problem here. However, after figuring out ferts, I'm not opposed to raising the intensity of the light and/or getting another light for better spread throughout the tank. My back stems tend to bend into the tank a bit to "chase" the light I have more positioned towards the front of the tank Any thoughts? Thanks again everyone!!

@Seattle_Aquarist I will definitely not be making any changes other than what you have suggested with the epsom salt for the next month. And I’ve been looking at all new leaf growth (especially with the AR mini) as well. I just thought it was an interesting topic to ponder on why the Monte Carlo in particular pops for a few days after a water change then looks horrible at the end of the week before a water change. Don’t see any changes yet on any new growth so far. Will keep current plan in place. Thanks again all!!!

Hi @JoeQ. Thanks for your response!! In the back of my mind, I wondered if using a GH booster would be a possible step. But with a GH of 10 coming out of the tap, it's crazy to think I'd need that. However, is it possible the GH that comes out of my tap is still very deficient of calcium? I know that monte carlo loves calcium, which would explain the trouble I'm having in growing it. But again, is it possible with a GH of 10? I'd hate to have too many variables/changes going on with my tank all at once, but just thought I'd throw out my latest observation on this. Thank you again!!

Hey @Seattle_Aquarist. I am currently doing the routine you had recommended for my tank x 1 month. I plan on doing this for the month, but wanted to bring up something I'm still observing and wanting your (or anyone's) input. In a previous post, I talked about how after I do my 50% weekly water change, about a day or so afterwards, some of my plants (especially my monte carlo!!) tend to perk up a bit. I have noticed this for at least the last couple months. And I'm still noticing it here again with my new process of adding Epsom salt after water changes. So to recap, on 10/6 I did a 50% water change and then dosed about 2 tsp of Epsom salt. I noticed a perk up in my monte carlo (greened up more, a bit of new growth) about 2 days later. Then as the week went on, it really started to struggle up to the day of my next water change. On 10/12, did another 50% water change and dosed 3/4 tsp Epsom salt. Again, today (10/14) noticed a perk up in my monte carlo. This is the same observation that I've had for a couple months, with the monte carlo looking poor by week's end. And I've been seeing this for awhile now even before beginning my Epsom salt dosing. Again, I'm going to finish out doing this x 1 month. But given the info here, is there anything else I'm introducing from my tap water (and my 50% water change) that would temporarily cause this perk up on monte carlo? Thank you all again for help on this!!

My water out of the tap is about the same as yours. Any suggestions for someone with those tap water parameters?

Your tank is gorgeous @Mmiller2001!! Again, the only fertilizer regimen I've known so far is just dosing Easy Green. So are you doing the EI method? When you say you're doing: Ca 24ppm Mg 8ppm NO3 30ppm PO4 10ppm K 40ppm Micros ( reported per dose and I dose 3 times a week) Fe DTPA - .12 ppm Fe gluc - .03 ppm Mn - .025 ppm B - .023 ppm Zn - .02 ppm Cu - .0021 ppm Mo - .001 ppm Ni - .00011 ppm How are you attaining these parameters? What products do you use? And do you start with RO water or do you use tap water? Again, I'm going to add Epsom salt to my current regimen to see if this helps, but it does look like I may ultimately need to go a stronger route soon. Just getting some education on this in case that's what I need to do. Again, tank is amazing!!! Would love that look some day!

Thanks to everyone for their responses so far. And thank you @Seattle_Aquarist for the in depth answer. I will definitely try adding some magnesium in the way you suggest for the next month. Have some Epsom salt already at home and will be doing this shortly. Also an interesting idea about when to add the fertilizer (thus when to add the iron). I usually add my fertilizer after the CO2 has been running for about 3 hours. I haven't measured what my pH drop is exactly at the 3 hour mark, but it has to be less than 7.0 at that point if I usually get to 6.6 by 4 hours after CO2 turns on. Does anyone see a iron deficiency in my tank as well in that I need to wait longer for my pH to drop so I have more available Fe in the water column when I fertilize? @Pepere to answer your question about my Easy Green dosing, I dose 4 pumps daily. This has kept me around a NO3 level of 30-40 all days of the week pretty much. Have been messing with this dosing for a while to be able to find this happy medium. I'm interested to talk more about your lighting comments though. Again, I had bumped up my Fluval light to 70% whites, 60% red, 10% blue, but I had a significant algae increase when I did that. Also did not get much different growth in my plants. And the algae seemed to calm down a bit once I went back to 60/50/2. Also like Bentley Pascoe's presentation on the Fluval light and his light intensity recommendations to reduce algae growth (leaving blue < 5%). Again, always up for recommendations on how my lights are done on this tank. This was just my experience over the last few months. @Mmiller2001 - Thanks for the reminder on good flow at the lower portion of the tank. I can't really see my monte carlo moving, but I do see a gently sway in my AR mini and crypts. I'd like to think I have decent circular flow with my lily pipes on one end and the wavemaker at the other end of the tank. Hate to have too much more flow because since I added the wavemaker, I've tried to put that thing in a bunch of different places in the tank so as to not "knock over" some of my stems in the back. I've seen an uptick in BBA on the areas of my stems that the wavemaker hits a bit more than other areas. Thanks again to everyone for your help!!!

Here's some pics of the tank. Hopefully you can all see them all right. Kind of bubbly in the tank since I did a water change earlier today. I do like the idea of dosing Easy Carbon (or the excel that I already have) after a water change. Might start doing that. Works good for spot dosing for me. Yeah, I was also thinking that Easy Green might not be enough for me given the number of plants I have and my setup. I had contemplated switching to Nilocg Thrive (or some kind of EI dosing method), but haven't fully thought it through yet. Not opposed to it though. I do just have 1 row of lights. I hopefully have enough light. I do have the light slightly more towards the front of the tank for the monte carlo and the AR mini. My back stem plants are reaching forward towards the light, but it's not gangly growth like you ask. Really don't want to have to get another light since when I did have it at a higher intensity, I grew more algae. I trim old plant growth often. Am due to cut the top half of the myrio and super red and plant the tops. If I do need to make a fertilizer change, any recommendations on something easy? Is Nilocg Thrive the next step here? If so, what dosing would you start with? I'm just not to the point yet of measuring out single nutrients and making solutions out of them. Let me know what you all think about the pics. I really appreciate the input so far!!

I've had my current tank going since February of this year, and I am having inconsistent growth within the different plants I have. I'm not seeing a specific nutrient deficiency, but wonder if I do in fact have one. Here's some info on my tank: 50 gallon tank with current parameters (NH3 - 0, NO2 - 0, NO3 - 30-40, pH 7.6 before CO2 turns on, 6.6 4 hours later, KH 4, GH 10, PO4 - 0.25-0.5 (can't seem to get this higher since maybe the stratum is soaking it up??)) Pressurized CO2 with pH drop of 1 - also getting lime to lime/yellow color on drop checker halfway into photoperiod Nilocg 24 inch CO2 reactor Fluval 3.0 plant light (60% whites, 50% red, 2% blue). 7 hour photo period to 1 hour ramp up and 1 hour ramp down. Calculated to get about 50-60 PAR at the front of tank at the substrate. Recently had this at 70% whites, 60% red, 10% blue - but this grew too much algae. Fluval stratum substrate with layer of Eco complete as a middle layer Oase Biomaster 850 thermo (Seachem Matrix in all but 2 compartments - others are left empty) Hydor Koralia nano wavemaker for a little extra flow (240 gph). Have good movement at the surface. Glass lily pipes with surface skimmer Fertilizer regimen - Easy Green All in One - 4 pumps daily. This has given me a nitrate level of 40 right before my weekly 50% water change. This was down from 6 pumps daily which I did up until about a month ago. Nitrates were around 80 before water change at that time so I decreased dose to 4 pumps daily Community guppies, cardinal tetras, cherry shrimp, amano shrimp. The tank is not highly stocked with fish. Been fighting with BBA for the last 6 months. Seems to not be spreading as much recently (see treatments below) Plants / growth since I began the tank in February 2023: Pogostemon octopus - growing OK. Not the fast heavy growth I was expecting. Just grows the spiky stuff here and there. Has not grown taller since I purchased it. Ludwigia super red - growing very slowly (1 inch every 2-3 weeks). Easy to get a bit of algae on lower parts of plant Myriophyllum mattogrossense - growing just fine. No problems Ozelet green sword - growing OK. Some die off of older plant leaves. Spots of it turn yellow, then the leaf dies. Some new growth here and there, but mostly very slow AR mini - great growth. Some leaf curling but not much Monte Carlo - extremely slow growing. Can't seem to get this to grow very well. Crypto lutea and beckettii - grows like it should. No issues. 2 types of buce - grows like it should. No issues Christmas moss - grows like it should. No issues Jungle val - does not grow at all!!! Has not gotten taller at all. Occasional new stem comes out, but extremely disappointed with this one. My thoughts: 1. Easy Green does not provide calcium in it's recipe. However I don't necessarily see calcium deficiency in my tank other than occasional leaf curl with AR mini. I also have a GH of 10 since I have pretty hard water in my region. However, not sure the makeup of my hard water (mostly Mg??). One interesting point here though, when I do a 50% water change, some of my plants seem to perk up (especially monte carlo) for a day or two, then go back to not growing well again. 2. During the summer I had to use hydrogen peroxide spot treatments and even 2 whole tank treatments to get rid of some bad BBA. Stopped doing this since I think it killed off my monte carlo too much??? Changed this over to Seachem Excel for spot treatments in which I've only done 3 recently. No whole tank treatment. No change in val growth (no melt) with this treatment. Did any of these treatments stunt the growth of my plants 3. Am I missing some micronutrient I'm not thinking of? I'm pretty sure my current dose of Easy Green is providing more than enough of the nutrients that are in the bottle. Anyway, I'd love to hear anyone's thoughts on this. Hopefully I have enough info about my tank here. The plants in my tank are fairly easy ones to take care of. Especially with having a medium/high tech setup. Can't explain why I'm not having huge growth with all my medium to fast growers. Any help with be much appreciated!!

I wondered about that. Occasionally during the year, the tap water smells like chlorine more than usual. I just e-mailed the city to see what's up as well. Thanks again!!

Thanks to everyone so far for your quick responses. This forum is really great!!! I do like the idea of trying a fertilizer with no nitrogen in it. That APT Zero might be a good choice for me. Seems to have similar other ingredients / ratios as Easy Green. May have to also supplement with phos as well. I will hold on to the Easy Green since I like it so much in case my tap water quality changes. I feel like I have a good mix of fast growing nutrient users. My tank seems sparsely planted since it's just been planted. Plus I used a lot of tissue culture plants. But I have myrio and floating plants that have gone nuts since I planted. All other ones doing well too. I might have to contact my water company and see what the deal is. We do drink our water in the house but it's run through a filter in the fridge. But good tip there about really trying not to drink it from the tap. I might also benefit from a new nitrate test kit?? Mine is a little over a year old. Anyway, if anyone has any more good ideas (all of them here have been so helpful), please let me know. But I may be leaning towards the APT Zero for a period of time until nitrates go back down in the tap. Thanks again everyone!!! I'm sure I'll have plenty of more questions in the near future.

Hi all. I was wanting anyone's opinion on a curve ball that got thrown my way when starting up my aquarium. The main problem here is when I first started preparing my tank and my plan of action, the nitrates in my tap water ranged from 0-10. All of a sudden in the last 2 weeks, they are now 20-40!! Here's my specs:50 gallon Landen tankFluval stratum substrate with a layer of Eco Complete in the middle (Bentley Pascoe recommendation)Fluval 3.0 plant light on 3 inch risers ( 70% on whites, 65% red, 5% blue). On for 7 hours a day with a 1 hour ramp up and 1 hour ramp downOase Biomaster Thermo 850 canister filter attached to glass lily pipes10 lb. CO2 canister hooked to a 24 inch NilocG reactorEasy Green fert dosing (Doing 1 ml per day for now. Was planning on upping dosing once tank/plants really established. See below for when tank was started, etc.)Doing 50%-80% water changes weekly (see note below on why so high)Tap water parameters - NH3 - 2, NO3 - 20-40, pH - 7.6, GH - 15, KH - 9Using Seachem Prime for water changes.Current tank parameters today (3/23) - NH3 - 0, NO2 - 0, NO3 - 80, pH (before lights on) 7.0 (I get a pH drop of 1 during the day), GH 12, KH 2Plants in the tank:Val AmericanaLudwigia super redMyrio mattogrossenseOzelet green swordChristmas mossBuce x 3 different typesCrypto petchiiMonte CarloAR miniSalivinia minima floating plantsFish:10 guppies (with at least 4 babies that I can see!!)Wanting to get more after initial phase of getting the tank startedSo I basically did a dark start method of starting up this tank back on 1/27. Cycle completed 2/27 and on 3/2 I planted all the plants above. Since 3/2, I've been doing what I have typed above (I've recently doubled my Easy Green dosing as plants have become established). Got fish last week on 3/17. Note that all of my plants (with the exception of a lot of melt from my swords plants) have excellent growth. No complaints there!! However, my nitrate level in my tank is consistently 80 or higher. I've been trying to stay at 50% water changes, however since my nitrate level is so high, I've done around 80% water changes a couple times. Couldn't figure out why so this week I tested my tap water and the nitrate level is 20-40. I was about ready to up my Easy Green dosing per instructions (put enough Easy Green in to attain 50 ppm of nitrate - then you can get a feel for how weekly dosing will go). But I can't do that any more with such high nitrate levels. As of right now, I only have a few very small areas of green string algae on my moss, but that's it. I worry that keeping nitrate so high will cause an algae outbreak plus be detrimental to my fish. Plus, I am afraid to add any more Easy Green since it is a nitrogen source as well.Sorry this is so long, but here's the question. I can't change what's in my tap water and I'm not going the RO route. What would everyone suggest I do fertilizer wise? I love using Easy Green (I use it in my son's low tech tank as well). However, I might have to use something that doesn't introduce as much or any nitrogen. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!!